Prothyon - 16

[farelios]

Where did you have it and where did you put it to make it work? You had it in vanilla movies?

Yeah, exactly. When I checked what folder FAF points to, it was different from where I pasted the files. Apparently, many years back I never noticed how install path for either game was in different HDDs.

[FFLazer]

Hi there! Just thought I'd stop by and give some feedback.

I was able to download and run the campaign map correctly for both single and multiplayer game, which I was very happy with . However my problem was the difficulty. I'm a bit of a noob, granted, and I only have a 600 global rating, but I couldn't pass the first bit for the life of me. In the end I was forced to turn cheating on just to see the rest of the campaign map.

With that said, I do really like this idea and I would love to see some more in the future. Maybe, providing you have the time, you could make some harder maps and also some easier maps to cater for us noobs. . Thanks!

[ZeRen]

Hi there! Just thought I'd stop by and give some feedback.

I was able to download and run the campaign map correctly for both single and multiplayer game, which I was very happy with . However my problem was the difficulty. I'm a bit of a noob, granted, and I only have a 600 global rating, but I couldn't pass the first bit for the life of me. In the end I was forced to turn cheating on just to see the rest of the campaign map.

With that said, I do really like this idea and I would love to see some more in the future. Maybe, providing you have the time, you could make some harder maps and also some easier maps to cater for us noobs. . Thanks!

yea this firts part is hard, but when you take whole island fun is starting
I upload my replay, if you wanna take a look

take me two hours to win, but what you would expect from noob

hints:
- overbuild power you need lot of overcharges
- you have to capture west center ASAP, I think without gun it is impossible to win(T2 on comm is good bonus) and you need the center to unlock this
- use two trasports one of them will be bait for inties

[speed2]

Its hard if you limit yourself to spam land. But you have air available, that means bombers, transports(ghetto gunships). With them its easy, without them its really hard, but still possible.

[Frylord]

Quite a fun map and will be interested to try out the eventually completed mission. Thought I'd repay the few hours of enjoyment with some feedback, so prepare thy self.


Preface.

Played it on coop with another random guy from chat, took roughly 4 attempts to complete with no communication outside pings and in-game chat.

All the failures were on the first section of the map, but that was down to finding a working strategy that didn't involve getting overwhelmed by T1 spam.

AI cheat and build multiplier x2 was on, but don't know if that was overwritten by the custom AI scripts used in the map or if we were playing on double the intended difficulty.


Part 1 – Western base.

We eventually completed this part by having our commanders hold the line with some dancing micro to avoid the arty spam and judicious use of overcharge, while building up some of our own arty to take the small western base and littering our base with AA PD.

Positives:
-Refreshingly difficult
-Rewards and encourages commander micro to avoid incoming ground / air fire
-Limited resources encourage vital reclamation and efficient eco management

Criticisms:
-Limited amounts of mex spots in the spawn area. With just two players, I had to survive with just one T2 mex while my ally had only 2 T1 mex.
There was a spot for a third, but due to the constant arty spam he couldn't reliably hold it. While reclaiming wrecks helped, most were destroyed due to having to use overcharge to hold the line.
-Due to the eastern air base, it was almost impossible to contest air. Bombing / drops were suicide missions and we simply didn't have the eco to compete with the intie spam.
-T2 PD in the middle of the base made the small drops we managed to sneak by pointless, and any attempts at a ninja cap of the tech centre doomed to failure.
-The rebuild speed of AI buildings was insane. Any ground we made while pushing had to be defended, as if we got pushed back any gain we had made was immediately lost.


Part 1 – Eastern base.

After the western base was destroyed and we had access to some T2 buildings / commander upgrades and more mex spots, the push on the eastern base was relatively easy. Due to the intie spam we couldn’t compete with and the AA PD, we didn't even bother trying to contest air and just focused on pure land spam.

Commander gun upgrades made the push to the second tech centre a breeze and then we began spamming some mongoose, the main base fell with little difficulty.

Positives:
-Not much to say about this part. Nothing immediately stood out as great, but was enjoyable to play.

Criticisms:
-Tech centre was too easy to capture just by hugging the western edge of the map. Little PD and units in that direction made walking a commander up and capturing it no challenge.
-Having access to much more mex points from the western base and being able to upgrade them to T2 made our eco feel very strong and lost the feeling of struggle we had when trying to take the first western base.
-Having nearly full access to T2 so early and no timed triggers meant we could take our time and spam up some shields and T2 pgens and just harden our base and eco. Felt a little cheesy.
-Compared to the struggle we had just to get a toe hold into the western land base, the eastern air base felt a little disappointingly easy.
-I felt like there was too many mex points in the eastern base too. After we had capped all of the mex points in T2 with some mass storage, it gave us enough eco to pretty much complete the entire mission without having to expand.


Part 2 – Southern base.

The giant wave of T2 units was unexpected but we were able to hold them off quite easy with just the commanders and our roving bands of mongoose.

There wasn't much strategy at this point and it devolved into a pure blob war. We had the range as the AI didn't seem to want to build anything other than tanks, mobile shields and rocket artillery. We managed to kite them to death while slowly working our way south.

The T2 gunships were a slight problem when we started to get into range of the southern base as we didn't bother with T1 air, though we may have been able to contest now with our stronger eco. Spamming up some T2 AA PD solved that problem anyway.

Taking the base and the tech centre was quite easy and nothing worth noting at this point.


Positives:
-Combined arms of the AI + rocket artillery spam made camping not really viable (due in part to no T2 ground PD, nice choice +1) and forced us to be aggressive and constantly mobile.

Criticisms:
-I think the AI was supposed to be scripted into doing drops, but when we pushed into the their base there was just a giant blob of T1 arty and some air transports, but they were not actually doing any drops.
-Air wasn't really a threat at any point. Due to having no timed triggers we had littered our bases with AA PD so the few waves of gunships that tried to harass our base were swiftly destroyed, despite us having zero air presence.
-Due to our ineffectual T1 air we had no air factories, so there was no real push to grab the T2 air tech centre. The large amount of enemy AA PD and how quick the AI rebuilt buildings also dissuaded me from building air units.

Part 3 – Final north-eastern base.

The huge wave of air and transports from the final base that landed on the coast was a little surprising and pretty much wrecked my entire base I had along the coast.

But again, due to the amount of AA PD we had most of their air force was destroyed and our highly mobile mongoose battalions destroyed all of their drops very quickly. This was the last real threat and challenge we faced on this map.

Initially we built a bunch of naval factories, but having only access to T1 they were only building subs, which in hindsight was pointless. We managed to win the sea battle with sheer numbers of amphibious tanks which subs can't hit.

After had controlled the sea, we invested in some T2 fighter/bombers to help control the waves of gunships and drops the AI was routinely sending.

Initially we tried to destroy the AI's last base with pure amphibious tanks, but due to their pretty crappy DPS and range, we resorted to massed mongoose drops on the beachhead which quickly overwhelmed their defences.

Positives:
-Was quite a fun and dramatic opening to the final part of the mission.
-No T2 navy, which I feel would have dominated the remainder of the mission and made much of the AI's threats obsolete.
-Forcing the use of combined arms, the mass use of transports, fighters to protect said transports, etc.

Criticisms:
-Like the southern base in part 2, there was a huge build up of units from the land factories on the island. I think they were supposed to be used in drops, but the AI didn't do anything with them. Not even to send them to meet us when we landed on their island.
We simply bombed them to death when we controlled most of the island and all that was left was this giant deathball of units.
-Navy was pretty pointless. Amphibious tanks destroyed all the AI's navy and shipyards, and subs could be ignored as they couldn't hit said hovering tanks.
-Once the initial huge drop wave have passed, there was no real threat from the AI and could be destroyed at our leisure.
-The huge wave of initial drops could be an unfair end to someone who hasn't got that far before and had their commander near the coast.


Overall, it was a very fun map and one of the few where I had to actually think about how to tackle problems.

General criticisms I have though:

-Make it so if one player loses his commander the mission doesn't end for everyone.
-Make the cutscenes skippable, the first few times is fine, but it grates after that.
-Tweak the amount of mex based on how many commanders are playing. Even with just two people, we quickly built a strong eco only after the first map was completed.
-Increase the difficulty to be as equally difficult as the first part of the map. We suffered quite severe power creep after the first portion of the map and it just got easier from there.
-Consider adding mongoose into the T2 AI spam, due to the short range of tanks they were using we could just kite them to death with no issue.

Anyway, I hope this ramble was of use.

- Frylord out.

[Flexable]

Very cool mission, but is there a way to change the difficulty? I play with my soon 9 years old son (need new players, right? ) and it's a bit complicated for him.

[speed2]

AI cheat and build multiplier x2 was on, but don't know if that was overwritten by the custom AI scripts used in the map or if we were playing on double the intended difficulty.

Campaign AI that Im using has set bonus, 2x build power on factories, 3x build power on engies. This forced me to add also more economy, I didnt want to add mexes since then player would have too much, but also giving AI almost no mexes wouldnt look good at base design. As I said before Im doing a compromise among keeping the campaign feel from base designs and attacks, and difficulty. I wanna do it harder, but still be very similar to campaign.

Part 1 – Western base.
Criticisms:
There was a spot for a third, but due to the constant arty spam he couldn't reliably hold it. While reclaiming wrecks helped, most were destroyed due to having to use overcharge to hold the line.

And you didnt mention enemey engies stealing reclaim! Anyway, yes, its annoing, there's not too much mass, but if you put engies on attack move from factory they'll reclaim everything and there will be enough mass and more you build, the more AI builds the more mass you have from it.

-T2 PD in the middle of the base made the small drops we managed to sneak by pointless, and any attempts at a ninja cap of the tech centre doomed to failure.

There is no intie production over western base. Once you kill those inties patroling at the beginning, there wont be more. Also AI is not building AA there. Then its easy to snipe that PD with bombers or ghetto gunships since AI wont react on just few air units. Since ghetto gunships are really OP there I already fixed AI to react on transports.

-The rebuild speed of AI buildings was insane. Any ground we made while pushing had to be defended, as if we got pushed back any gain we had made was immediately lost.

Yes its either you break through or AI rebuilds it again. With some static T1 AA, building air actually pays off, cause I'd bet those T1 bombers from AI are annoing for you, killing all your units constanly, well you can do the same thing to AI since AI is attacking in formations and units are always grouped up ready to be bombed.

Part 1 – Eastern base.
After the western base was destroyed and we had access to some T2 buildings / commander upgrades and more mex spots, the push on the eastern base was relatively easy. Due to the intie spam we couldn’t compete with and the AA PD, we didn't even bother trying to contest air and just focused on pure land spam.

I might restrict one of the upgrades here to make it more of a challenge, either gun or T2, Im not sure yes.
You can build air, combination with static AA you'll have more than AI.

Criticisms:
-Tech centre was too easy to capture just by hugging the western edge of the map. Little PD and units in that direction made walking a commander up and capturing it no challenge.

Im not sure if I want to change this, since its not obvious for everyone, so it might be a reward for those who are able to think outside of the box.

-Having access to much more mex points from the western base and being able to upgrade them to T2 made our eco feel very strong and lost the feeling of struggle we had when trying to take the first western base.
-Having nearly full access to T2 so early and no timed triggers meant we could take our time and spam up some shields and T2 pgens and just harden our base and eco. Felt a little cheesy.

I ll change it to not allow mass storage, that will reduce eco by 50%. I ll allow it somewhere later.

-Compared to the struggle we had just to get a toe hold into the western land base, the eastern air base felt a little disappointingly easy.

The thing is these bases were designed to work together so yes, once you kill one it gets easier. I dont want to change this anymore to not make the mission even longer.

-I felt like there was too many mex points in the eastern base too. After we had capped all of the mex points in T2 with some mass storage, it gave us enough eco to pretty much complete the entire mission without having to expand.

As I said, a compromise between giving AI mexes to be not look dull and not giving player too much eco. But since Air base is really small, there will be good amout of mass for players. But don't forget that number of mexes of AI doesnt matter that much since it can cheat. And from southern base there are multipliers set to AI eco. I set them so AI has just enough mass to run its projects + enegies will still reclaim. So its not overflowing mass like crazy, but its still trying to steal reclaim everywhere.

Part 2 – Southern base.
The giant wave of T2 units was unexpected but we were able to hold them off quite easy with just the commanders and our roving bands of mongoose.

Land attacks are less likely to cause problems, since AI is moving then in formation and they move slowly.

-I think the AI was supposed to be scripted into doing drops, but when we pushed into the their base there was just a giant blob of T1 arty and some air transports, but they were not actually doing any drops.

Yes it should do drops. And it work for me 9/10 cases. No idea why its sometimes not building transports. Then it bugs out like this.

Part 3 – Final north-eastern base.
The huge wave of air and transports from the final base that landed on the coast was a little surprising and pretty much wrecked my entire base I had along the coast.

This is more like a mass gift, just for a good show. Its hard to kill player at the point of the game with these attacks. Once you're well established I dont this the campaign AI can cause too much problems. It can cause some problems and be annoying some making it more difficult can be achieved by time limit.

Initially we built a bunch of naval factories, but having only access to T1 they were only building subs, which in hindsight was pointless. We managed to win the sea battle with sheer numbers of amphibious tanks which subs can't hit.

Its set to build some navy to counter Riptides, but don't want to set it to build too much. So it doesnt take forever to kill this base. Since you have to realize this is +- half of the intended lenght of this mission

Criticisms:
-Like the southern base in part 2, there was a huge build up of units from the land factories on the island

Yes it should do drops and be annoying with them...

-The huge wave of initial drops could be an unfair end to someone who hasn't got that far before and had their commander near the coast.

I dont think this can kill an ACU, there is enough to run away. And units doenst target ACU first.
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Very cool mission, but is there a way to change the difficulty? I play with my soon 9 years old son (need new players, right? ) and it's a bit complicated for him.

No, there isnt and probably won't be. Since Im making it from the beginning with only one difficulty and it would take even more time to rewrite it and balance it. I wanted this to be harder since we already have 24 easy missions
Once its done I wont mind if someone redo my mission to add eeasier difficulty as well under one condition that the difficulty I set will not be touched as it will be on hard setting.

TLDR:

Spoiler: show

If you dont want to read, what are you doing on forum?

[H2H_TechMonkey]

Since last patch I cant play the map any more, the game starts, but it just stays zoomed out on the map and the ACU's never spawn, no dulcet Gyle tones.

Trying 2 player and have played before.

[speed2]

coop doesnt work atm, I think it was posted on What's New page. They're working on the fix.

[H2H_TechMonkey]

Sorry dude, didnt spot it.

Keep up the good work though, the map is awesome