Balance Patch 3674 Feedback Thread

[Nepty]

Revert hp changes.

revert hp changes, i thought just about everyone was against them when we last discussed it...

NO...

Give cybran buildings proper regen, all of them.

I agree. Shouldn't take 12 minutes for a t1 power plant to self repair from 1 HP. An incredibly crappy self repair wasn't my idea when I presented it. I wanted it to be useful. Around 3 or 5 minutes. Cybran are like the Borg. Cybernetic nanobots repair damaged structures automatically. We must justify the low HP buildings.

In its current state it's about as useful as a megalith AA gun...

(way to go Zock. Why didn't you go with my stealth power plants idea? Natural radar stealth for all cybran power generators.)

[angus000]

I like the changes but...

Id like Zock to explain why does he think that having buildings regenerate in 10 mins is more useful than not having any regenaration at all. To begin with, regeneration is like repairing, it has little to no usefulness, except is free. If we want it to be a new game mechanic, it at least has to be of some use.

Also, why not have Seraphim be the one with extra toughness? I never got why the more advanced alien technology is always inferior in almost all aspects. Their buildings being tougher would at least make sense and to be honest they need it more than UEF. Like someone said, they are usually pretty tanky and also could use some buff in their late game (aside from the improvements for the Ithotha). They could actually be in the spot they deserve in regards of balance with both buffs.

[ZLO_RD]

I never got why the more advanced alien technology is always inferior in almost all aspects. Their buildings being tougher would at least make sense and to be honest they need it more than UEF.

i thought it always was more like: UEF simple and tought, sera and aeon are more fancy so they are less tought, cybran is now weak cause we can't just stop nerfing them.
that is what i thought.... but i was checking database very long time ago, and it looked more like units with one specific purpose had more HP than units with more abilities... like Cybran and Sera battleships have less hp cause they have aa, torps, tmd, radar, sonar and maybe even more useless things (for cyb)/ nuke (for sera)
but i guess it is up to balance team to decide with faction is supposed to be more tought and witch supposed to be weaker but fancyer.
Edit: idk what is reason behind hp changes, probably just to nerf cybran and make eco sniping to be better option (and HQ sniping)

[Mad`Mozart]

Is this the right place to cry about t2 land being nonexistent?

[Zock]

Id like Zock to explain why does he think that having buildings regenerate in 10 mins is more useful than not having any regenaration at all. To begin with, regeneration is like repairing, it has little to no usefulness, except is free. If we want it to be a new game mechanic, it at least has to be of some use.

Obviously any amount of regen is better than zero. But yes, the real advantage is extremely marginal, even with bigger values I don't think any amount of regen can add enough advantage to the faction as the hp nerfs remove. So if cybran turns out too weak from the changes, buffing regen can be done, but I believe other buffs will be in order too, optimally buffs that enhance the factions strengths to support the whole point of the changes, which is diversity.

The regen wasn't really my idea, I don't think it's bad, but it's not there to be an equal compensation for the HP nerfs or an important game mechanic, I don't think that can be done in a good way. It's just a gimmick. The values are set conservatively,let's say a 100% increase is not incredible unlikely, but we wanted to observe the impact of the changes first. And it's not up to me to decide anymore now.

Is this the right place to cry about t2 land being nonexistent?

Nerfing t3 was one of my major goals from the beginning, with all the problems surrounding balance I wasn't able to accomplish it, but the whole patch is about halfway done and as far as I understood is still planned to be the next patch. Helping with it might be more productive than crying.

[ZeRen]

so after this huge Cybran nerfs I think could be fair to finally give Cybran ED4 as T3 shield

best would be to separate it to T2 and T3, Cyb T2 would be ED1>ED2>ED3 (this stay same) and T3 would be ED4>ED5 (but cheaper so it actually worth to build), ED4 would be possible to build as T3

PLEASE REMOVE THE UPGRADE ANNOYANCE

and balance T3 static arty, different range is unfair and make (especially) Cybran arty worthless

[Ithilis_Quo]

So to the feedback:

- why is jagged post it while zock is balance cancerlor ?
- hp changes, why should uef have 50% more hp as cybran? For what they should have this buff? Alredy its far most played faction, UEF is new cybran, and this buff them even more, whiteout any logical reason, so whats that reason?
-- to regeneration, even when its neraly neglect, still can cause problem as when damage something and then must doubt how much hp it should regenerate until next salvo. Already its probably ok, while we probably dont have weapon that colide with numbers, but on future this is big warning of future problems.
--- dont understand why its only on some building and not in all, its unlogical that mex and wall can regenerate and pd, air staging, radar.... not. Why make half done job when realse it?
- Yotha, damn, seriously? This is like joke. Main problem with Yotha definitly isnt 45range when experimenta use 45r as patern. Yotha have total diferent and bigger problems as lacking +2range.
- what is this patch trying to solve and improve? While did we have problem with uef be too weak while we bufing them as this?

If i leave aside this points, patch is oweral good.

[biass]

Good luck JaggedAppliance.

[angus000]

Spoiler: show

Id like Zock to explain why does he think that having buildings regenerate in 10 mins is more useful than not having any regenaration at all. To begin with, regeneration is like repairing, it has little to no usefulness, except is free. If we want it to be a new game mechanic, it at least has to be of some use.

Obviously any amount of regen is better than zero. But yes, the real advantage is extremely marginal, even with bigger values I don't think any amount of regen can add enough advantage to the faction as the hp nerfs remove. So if cybran turns out too weak from the changes, buffing regen can be done, but I believe other buffs will be in order too, optimally buffs that enhance the factions strengths to support the whole point of the changes, which is diversity.

The regen wasn't really my idea, I don't think it's bad, but it's not there to be an equal compensation for the HP nerfs or an important game mechanic, I don't think that can be done in a good way. It's just a gimmick. The values are set conservatively,let's say a 100% increase is not incredible unlikely, but we wanted to observe the impact of the changes first. And it's not up to me to decide anymore now.

Is this the right place to cry about t2 land being nonexistent?

Nerfing t3 was one of my major goals from the beginning, with all the problems surrounding balance I wasn't able to accomplish it, but the whole patch is about halfway done and as far as I understood is still planned to be the next patch. Helping with it might be more productive than crying.

Thanks for replying Zock, I really appreciate it. It's a shame you're not the balance councilor anymore; I really liked your job.

Also, congratulations to JaggedAppliance for becoming the new BC. I'm sure you can do just as good a job as Zock was doing (with your collaboration anyway).

[JaggedAppliance]

So to the feedback:

- why is jagged post it while zock is balance cancerlor ?
- hp changes, why should uef have 50% more hp as cybran? For what they should have this buff? Alredy its far most played faction, UEF is new cybran, and this buff them even more, whiteout any logical reason, so whats that reason?
-- to regeneration, even when its neraly neglect, still can cause problem as when damage something and then must doubt how much hp it should regenerate until next salvo. Already its probably ok, while we probably dont have weapon that colide with numbers, but on future this is big warning of future problems.
--- dont understand why its only on some building and not in all, its unlogical that mex and wall can regenerate and pd, air staging, radar.... not. Why make half done job when realse it?
- Yotha, damn, seriously? This is like joke. Main problem with Yotha definitly isnt 45range when experimenta use 45r as patern. Yotha have total diferent and bigger problems as lacking +2range.
- what is this patch trying to solve and improve? While did we have problem with uef be too weak while we bufing them as this?

If i leave aside this points, patch is oweral good.

- I am now the balance councilor.
- The hp changes should be considered first in terms of creating more options and interesting gameplay differences between factions, secondarily we have the faction balance concerns which can be addressed if we are happy with the general impact on gameplay of these changes.
- I agree with your concerns concerning regen, the new balance team which will be announced soon™ will be looking at this latest patch closely.
- I'd like to hear what you think the main problems are with the Ythotha.
- Again, the focus of this patch was not factional balance per se, future patches will focus more on factional balance.