Firebeetle DoT

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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby IceDreamer » 21 Sep 2019, 21:05

UnorthodoxBox wrote:
it´s required to steamlink my account and i refuse to do that ...

Why


Baseless paranoia
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby Apofenas » 22 Sep 2019, 04:19

My suggestion


I suggest to use Fire Beetle as an unique EMP weapon that's aimed to stunn large groups of units instead of standalone sniping tool which was proven to be a cancer and nerfed into nothing.
BalanceVictim wrote:I tried it out, and yes, the anti-torpedo is a useful tool now. Sadly, the rest of the unit is still extremely weak compared to any other frig
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby MrTBSC » 22 Sep 2019, 19:20

UnorthodoxBox wrote:
it´s required to steamlink my account and i refuse to do that ...

Why



1. i dislike steam
2. i have no interest linking my account to a thirdparty programm potentionaly getting access to my information of the steamaccount (yea laugh and call me paranoid on that one i don´t give a f**k)
3. FAF at the moment for my personal taste does not varrant steamlinking because of the lack of what it offers regarding ranked play ..

soooo at the very least i rather wait (don´t care how long that´ll take ... maybe never ..) until steamlinking is no longer required
or FAF (which is unlikely cause of community stuborness for the most part) ups its game by making the game more intresting and fun regarding groundplay ..
cause in my personal opinion the t1 phase that has been prolonged is this game´s most boring phase and might require 2 more options per faction to be intresting .. for me at least ..
i still consider the factions not diverse enough, to me the t2 phase should be rather the mainphase of this game with fair diversaty between factions (where t3 and experimental is the bonusstuff) but it doesn´t realy feel like it last i played ... many even straight up skip t2 for t3 ...

the funny thing about faf is they wanted to ballance the game without changing the coregameplay from vanilla .. yet they did (HQ mod) .. the changes they however went with for the most part imo rather had a negative impact ... and that over what? 10 or so years?
i say screw it .. go and expand the game to a degree that makes sense ...
they added blackops AA units in t3 (that´s already another big change from vanilla FA) .. i say have some balls and add a couple more (not all) ... sure the BO units were OP/unballanced but they spiced the game up imo ..
try and add nomad to ranked if at all possible .. yes, it´s work .. yes, its another level of ballancing factions but that faction brings its own flavor to the coregame ...

the game from both last i played and the last 70 or so casts (about 300 to 400 total) i watched feels too much like "tankrush t1 through t3 the game" with the primary focus on the faction´s assault units and barely anything else ..

IceDreamer wrote:unwillingness to think outside the box

wonder why that is ..
is it the game´s current general ballance and/or difficulty to use such specialty units ?

IceDreamer wrote:Baseless paranoia

right, so easy to give yourself such an answer .. but sure if you want to believe that .. go on ..


sry for the long answer but i rather not derail this thread and leave the answer in just one post ..
Last edited by MrTBSC on 22 Sep 2019, 22:40, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby UnorthodoxBox » 22 Sep 2019, 19:48

This reminds me of bisq calling everyone who beats him a smurf or a cheater and claiming Gorton is out to kill him or whatever.
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby MrTBSC » 22 Sep 2019, 19:55

UnorthodoxBox wrote:This reminds me of bisq calling everyone who beats him a smurf or a cheater and claiming Gorton is out to kill him or whatever.


pls don´t tell me you are aplying any of this shit to what i said .. couldn´t be any worse of a analogy ..
also topic pls ...

Apofenas wrote:My suggestion


I suggest to use Fire Beetle as an unique EMP weapon that's aimed to stunn large groups of units instead of standalone sniping tool which was proven to be a cancer and nerfed into nothing.


need te be more userfriendly and cheaper then ...
Last edited by MrTBSC on 22 Sep 2019, 21:41, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby armacham01 » 22 Sep 2019, 21:04

Maybe I am paranoid, but every time I've been asked to do something like link my steam account, I change my Steam password afterwards.

If you want to create perfect separation between your current steam account and FAF, make a new steam account and buy Forged Alliance on that. Link that to your FAF account. If you are truly paranoid, put this new steam account on a separate computer from the one that you normally use. Once you verify your account, you can use that account to play FAF from any computer.

Every 1-3 months, Forged Alliance goes on sale down to like $2.59 so this is not exactly a big investment. It is probably what smurfs have to do (but if you've only got one FAF account, it's not smurfing and it's not against any rule).
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby MrTBSC » 22 Sep 2019, 21:13

armacham01 wrote:Maybe I am paranoid, but every time I've been asked to do something like link my steam account, I change my Steam password afterwards.

If you want to create perfect separation between your current steam account and FAF, make a new steam account and buy Forged Alliance on that. Link that to your FAF account. If you are truly paranoid, put this new steam account on a separate computer from the one that you normally use. Once you verify your account, you can use that account to play FAF from any computer.

Every 1-3 months, Forged Alliance goes on sale down to like $2.59 so this is not exactly a big investment. It is probably what smurfs have to do (but if you've only got one FAF account, it's not smurfing and it's not against any rule).


i have no interest in rebuying FA (i basicaly already have 2 copies with having used the vanila supcom cdcode granting me a free FAcopy) just to get FAF going in a state of balance and lack of diversaty were i am not motivated to play it ..
at the moment i merely have an interest in watching it and see how it develops ..

perfect seperation to me is not having faf be linked to steam in any way ...

do you have anything to say bout the beetle?
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby Wesmania » 23 Sep 2019, 01:29

At first glance I'm not fond of the beetle-as-a-landmine idea, I'd like to know more about it. In particular:

* It seems useless against ACU pushes, since ACUs have omni.
* It's even more useless for drops, since damage was decreased to 1k (proportionally to mass decrease, but with with huge e cost increase and worse transport capacity).
* For the same reason (and reduced health) they can't be used for any non-covert action like current beetles (barely) can.
* A single beetle costs 50 energy to maintain cloak, which is ~120 mass assuming t2 pgens. It looks like a waste of energy compared to just more corsairs.
* I get the impression minefields could be efficiently cleared by suiciding a lot of low value units like scouts and LABs.
* Useless anywhere on the battlefield that isn't a chokepoint.
* Hard-obsoleted by T3 air scouts, since they're only useful at easily scoutable chokepoints.

The closest counterpart to a beetle landmine is a T1 PD, so I'll compare the two:
* T1 PD can be built by T1 engineers. Beetles have to be built in T2 land factories and transported to their destination.
* T1 PD costs 250 mass. Beetle costs 200 mass and much more energy, plus fixed energy upkeep (~120 mass equivalent).
* T1 PD can protect against small raids without dying. Beetles can't.
* T1 PD die to artillery easily. Beetles can kill a few, but large groups are unhindered.
* T1 PD can stop about 2 T2 advancing units. Beetles with their 1k damage can wound, but not kill T2 units, I expect 2 beetles to take out 5 T2 tanks on average.
* Beetles are cloaked, T1 PDs aren't. Does not matter in 90% of cases when deep in your own territory, it might matter in front of firebases and such.
* T1 PDs stop unupgraded ACUs and can slow down advancing ACUs if under shields in a firebase. Beetles die easily to unupgraded ACUs and surrounding units.
* T1 PDs can't be airdropped. Beetles aren't worth airdropping.
* Beetles are obsoleted by omni and T3 air scouts. T1 PDs aren't.
* T1 PDs have more range.

In short, I see exactly 2 scenarios where beetles are superior to T1 PDs: waiting in front of firebases or in frontal chokepoints for an enemy run-by to come through, or waiting in the same chokepoints for high-value targets like T3 units or experimentals. In the latter scenario corsairs are just as cost-effective and have chance not to die, maybe beetles kill shields more effectively. I suppose beetle mines are genuinely good in the earlier, but I think scenarios like this are pretty rare.
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby FtXCommando » 23 Sep 2019, 01:41

Gonna fly to Ireland and bang a pan outside of jagged’s home if he starts entertaining the idea of forcing players to play with/against nomads or introducing blackops units into default balance.
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Re: Firebeetle DoT

Postby MrTBSC » 23 Sep 2019, 13:23

Wesmania wrote:At first glance I'm not fond of the beetle-as-a-landmine idea, I'd like to know more about it. In particular:

* It seems useless against ACU pushes, since ACUs have omni.
* It's even more useless for drops, since damage was decreased to 1k (proportionally to mass decrease, but with with huge e cost increase and worse transport capacity).
* For the same reason (and reduced health) they can't be used for any non-covert action like current beetles (barely) can.
* A single beetle costs 50 energy to maintain cloak, which is ~120 mass assuming t2 pgens. It looks like a waste of energy compared to just more corsairs.
* I get the impression minefields could be efficiently cleared by suiciding a lot of low value units like scouts and LABs.
* Useless anywhere on the battlefield that isn't a chokepoint.
* Hard-obsoleted by T3 air scouts, since they're only useful at easily scoutable chokepoints.

The closest counterpart to a beetle landmine is a T1 PD, so I'll compare the two:
* T1 PD can be built by T1 engineers. Beetles have to be built in T2 land factories and transported to their destination.
* T1 PD costs 250 mass. Beetle costs 200 mass and much more energy, plus fixed energy upkeep (~120 mass equivalent).
* T1 PD can protect against small raids without dying. Beetles can't.
* T1 PD die to artillery easily. Beetles can kill a few, but large groups are unhindered.
* T1 PD can stop about 2 T2 advancing units. Beetles with their 1k damage can wound, but not kill T2 units, I expect 2 beetles to take out 5 T2 tanks on average.
* Beetles are cloaked, T1 PDs aren't. Does not matter in 90% of cases when deep in your own territory, it might matter in front of firebases and such.
* T1 PDs stop unupgraded ACUs and can slow down advancing ACUs if under shields in a firebase. Beetles die easily to unupgraded ACUs and surrounding units.
* T1 PDs can't be airdropped. Beetles aren't worth airdropping.
* Beetles are obsoleted by omni and T3 air scouts. T1 PDs aren't.
* T1 PDs have more range.

In short, I see exactly 2 scenarios where beetles are superior to T1 PDs: waiting in front of firebases or in frontal chokepoints for an enemy run-by to come through, or waiting in the same chokepoints for high-value targets like T3 units or experimentals. In the latter scenario corsairs are just as cost-effective and have chance not to die, maybe beetles kill shields more effectively. I suppose beetle mines are genuinely good in the earlier, but I think scenarios like this are pretty rare.


it could be both a defensive deployeable landmine and still a offensive antiarmy microoption that supports your tanks causing both damage and a emp effect .. a acu may have omni but if out of possition it still may get heavily damaged depending on the situation maybe even stunned ..
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