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Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 03:43
by This_Guy
Now, I have never liked TML in this game, it has always seemed a bit too strong imo. If you get t2 same as other guys and build tmd same time they build tml you will get it done 1st, however little chance getting that t2 engy across the map to the expansion in time to save that. Now i get that the point is dont upgrade mexes unless you can defend them, but 4 mexes in base is hard to run t2, and build tmd and not also die to spam. Also, being required to make so many TMD isnt exactly cheap. Tml is expensive, but you only need 1 to do damage, where some maps to defend all your mexes you need 5 and sometimes more so none are vulnerable. Then if other team makes more tml, you need to make another 5 etc. Not to mention, in most teamgames people assist eachother with the upgrades, so theyre done faster still. Now, this has always bugged me, however i can live with it. A bit of salt when it happens but move on.

However, there is a big trend lately of people building 3+ tml to snipe through your tmd, and unless youre aeon you cant stop them. I have played in a game where i had 3 tmd vs 4 tml and they still got through to kill my t3 mex (Cybran hp op). I have seen this get to stupid levels on eco whore maps like canis and hilly where one team can make so many tml that even 10+tmd and a few shields cannot stop them, and on these maps because you have so much eco you can usually build the TML and still be comfortable ecowise. Again, i know that mass in TML is no mass somewhere else, but the counter to the TML in TMD just isnt effective enough unless youre aeon (But then you have the range issues). Usually (as there are 2 people in the 'mid' slot in team games) one guy will build a firebase that cannot get pushed through easily, while the other guy uses all his eco to spam TML. But the time you can break that firebase, usually the damage is done. Only real way to counter this is by working as a team (lmao) and having the whole team crush the base before it can deal damage, but then that only give advantage to other guys on their team who can exploit this.

IMO TMD needs a buff or TML nerf. I understand that will impact MML's effectiveness, and i get as a balancing point it is hard to do (if not close to impossible). I know that not every change will make every player happy, and if nothing is changed so be it. This is just me inputing my complaint of a trend of recent games. I have played too many games of late where this has happened and it is really starting to put me off playing.

Anyways, that's my rant done. (this was made after the 3rd game in a couple of days where i have had TML hit things 'defended' by tmd :D)

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 03:55
by Anihilnine
I personally wouldnt mind if all types of ACU insta-sniping were nerfed. Basically ACUs would be hardened against TML, Mercy, Fire beetle.
Other things are ok ... gunships, tanks, t2 bombers.

I dont mind base being TML'd, but I see your point.

edit: meant to say wouldn't

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 03:57
by This_Guy
TBF i dont really care about the sniping. Its easy enough to see TML coming for ACU and move out of the way, TML arent that fast through the air. It the static targets that cant move that i have an issue with.

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 05:35
by moonbearonmeth
This_Guy wrote:Only real way to counter this is by working as a team (lmao)

The only way to counter a co-ordinated attack is with a co-ordinated defense, who knew.

Also one might argue needing TMD all over the map isn't exactly necessary especially given that the missile itself costs around five times more than the T1 mex it would be targeting were it outside the 'core'

I'm not too concerned with whether or not TML/D gets buffed/nerfed but I found these two things interesting

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 06:02
by This_Guy
Yes, i know you could coordinate. But in all seriousness how often will a team work together because the other team is? Doesnt happen often. People teamup to make offensive weapons like TML, t4's , t2 coms etc, but rarely to make defensive things, rather just defend their own stuff. Therefore 2 people focusing on a TML can hurt 1 guy trying to defend himself. I know this is an issue with players, not the TML, but as it stands thats how it is.

Also, noone in their right mind would kill a t1 mex with a TML, i never said that. But eventually all t1 mexes should become t2 as the game goes on, then even t3 at some stages. And as said before, atm cybran t3 mex can die to 1 TML. People dont just tech up the mexes in their bases. Then for that one mex sitting on its own, you need a tmd to kill a TML missle, but if they make 2, your TMD is then void, need 2. etc. Thats what I am saying.

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 06:32
by Anihilnine
Well yeah but another way of looking at it is you shouldn't tech up unsafe noncore mexes and you should punish people who do.

So in answer to your question I think yeah early TML is a little OP because you target the whole map. However I don't know if we need to change it.

It forces people to do something beside ecoing.

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 06:55
by Evan_
(edit: forgot this was my opinion and not fact) IMO it would help to nerf early TML rush if it wasn't buildable by t2 acus. It comes the second your gun + t1 push fails, and basically lets them get free kills on all t2 mexes and any upgrading acu/factory if you don't have any tech and just gun/spam.

Also TML has way too much hp. If nothing else, I'd like to see it dropped so that we can bomb it, or you have to operate a shield.

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 07:56
by This_Guy
Considering how little hp TMD has, a lower hp that 2-3 bombers could kill isnt a bad idea. Means you have to defend it well. Rushing it means you probably wont have flak or shield to defend it. Not a bad thought IMO.

Only thing is that wont help the TML spam that is occurring atm

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 08:01
by Anihilnine
Yeah making them fairly fragile sounds good.

Re: Is TML op?

PostPosted: 16 Jan 2018, 10:18
by Mephi
As usual replay(s) pls ;)