Some Balance Suggestions

[JoonasTo]

Since I’ve been asked by some people to share my thoughts about what needs to improve in the current balance, here are some specific issues I think should be addressed.


EARLY GAME AIR

T1 Interceptor
Minimum speed down to 8
*Currently the interceptors are very bad at shooting down turning T1 bombers(they fly too far after the target), especially in head on engagements. This would increase ability of interceptors to follow them into the turns, even if they’re not completely parallel to each other.
→ The closer we get to 0, the better they become at shooting down landing transports and gunships so going beyond 8(which is what ASF and Swifties have btw.) might turn out to be detrimental in that area.

T1 Mobile AA
HP: Nerf UEF and Seraphim HP to 260
*T1 AA got double the HP and double the damage in a previous patch, this lead to it being 4X as strong as before, with only double the cost(and even more effective due to invisible buff in roll-off time.) This is especially visible against gunships and other hovering air units(such as transports.) If we want to keep the effectiveness versus bombers the same we can not touch the damage, so we need to nerf the HP.
→ This will nerf them vs gunships without having too much effect vs T1 bombers
Seraphim muzzle velocity buff
*It’s just too low to hit t2 bombers
→ Needs to be buffed to be a reliable early game AA option


MIDDLE GAME

T2 Flak
Speed: Increase speed across all factions to at least 3, preferably 3,5
*This will have them keep up with most things on the ground(and not miraculously speed up when entering water for the hovering ones.)
→ Perhaps you want the non hover ones to be 3.7 to differentiate between factions and buff them compared to hover ones
*Will make getting your flak to your front line faster
→ Indirect nerf to T2 snipes
*They got dummy weapons to keep them from suiciding on attack move now.
→ The original reason for the speed nerf is gone
Radical muzzle velocity buff while decreasing damage(if necessary)
*Single flight over flak will always do damage, but not kill everything
→ Also easy to vary between factions with AoE/Burst Damage/DPS should we wish to
- For example;
#Seraphim: Highest DPS, lowest AoE, best at killing t3 gunships, ghettos
#Cybran: Largest AoE, lowest burst, best at killing t2 gunships
#UEF: Decent all around
#Aeon: Highest Burst, lowest DPS, best at killing bombers
*Multiple flights or multiple flak will always kill swarms
→Leads to area denial with flak like it was always meant to be

T2 HQs
Make Air HQ more expensive
*Currently the air HQ is the only one in the old cost, while the navy and the land HQs got a cost increase. This buffed T2 air option too much, making it the preferred tech choice along with T2 commander(if that is an option on the map.)
→This will fix the skewed balance between T2 air and T2 land
Make Land HQ cheaper
*The cost difference between T3 and T2 HQs in he land path is too small and the vulnerability of T2 to gun ACUs makes them a bad choice in the current meta on most maps. Lowering the initial investment into that tech could help to bring more light to the T2 stage.
→This will also indirectly nerf T2 snipes because flak becomes more accessible


COMMANDERS

Cybran Commander Stealth
Give the stealth commander 25 regen with 500/10k cost
*The Cybran commander has always lacked an early game survivability upgrade, adding some regen to the stealth upgrade with a slight cost increase should help them a bit if they get cornered while still making sure they don’t stand a chance in a standup fight
→ It is important that the build time stays the same since stealth commander needs to take advantage of the power vacuum in the field to have maximum effectiveness

Aeon Commander Shield
Recharge time to 70 seconds
*This is more than enough time for the commander to die if sufficient forces(guncom does 14k damage in that time without overcharge, so it will still draw with an UEF nano com) are present but not so weak that it has to shy away from every engagement it sees.
→ Also balances nicely between UEF and SERA combat upgrades cost/benefit wise
Energy draw to 85 power
*This is in line with the heavier shield draw and allows one more overcharge per minute
→ So only one less than UEF and Sera Nano coms


AMPHIBIOUS UNITS

Zhtuue
Speed on water to 2,4-2,2
*While Zhtuee spam is easily counterable if you have time, apm and knowledge to do so it is also one of the units that didn’t get the hover nerf and this has made Seraphim relatively far too strong on some maps. This should diminish that a bit.
→ Also an indirect buff to all other hover units, especially the Aurora on the same maps

Wagner
Speed to 3,3 underwater
*Wagners are much harder to kill underwater than the hover tanks of other factions due to being safe from most forms of damage, they shouldn’t be faster in water than the other faction’s more vulnerable counterparts. This would make them same speed as Riptides in water too, as they are on land.
→ This also brings them in line with the amphibious unit nerf and normalises the balance on raid heavy water maps to what it was before that.


LATE GAME AIR

Restorer
Increase AA damage by 33-50% OR increase it’s speed by 3-4
*Currently the restorer ties with a broadsword in 1v1 with no micro and if you kite you can win by a slight margin, this is stupid for a unit named AA gunship. If we wish to keep it as a bad option vs ground, we want to buff the AA missile damage(not cost, ground damage or health.)
→ This will also make it better vs asf, currently 50% of the mass in asf beats restorers with ease, this would increase it to 60-70%(did not test so estimated)
*If we were to buff the speed instead, it could kite all gunships with relative ease and even interceptors to some extent without affecting it’s combat balance(and not call for further changes if ASF are to be rebalanced in the future.)
→ Would also fit the aeon faction theme of control your units or leave them to die

Strategic Bombers
Energy cost to 125k
*The current energy cost for strats is far too high to make them a viable option in most even games with ASF on the field, this would make them a slightly more viable option.
→ I don’t think this makes them worth rushing on t2 pgens in most games but it is a possibility and has to be monitored


ECONOMY

Mass Fabs
HP differentiation
*The mass fabs are not currently part of the faction HP differentiation, they should be:
- T2 massfabs
#Cybran: 250
#Aeon: 300
#Seraphim: 320
#UEF: 360
- T3 massfabs
#Cybran:5,5
#Aeon:6,0
#Seraphim:6,6
#UEF:8,0
Make T2 fabs twice more expensive to build
*T2 mass fabs are currently ridiculously good, the efficiency of T3 power/T2 mass fab grid is better than a T3 mex upgrade(or one built on an empty spot for that matter, reclaiming T2 mex and replacing it with a T3 mex is better.)
→ This should also indirectly buff T3 mass fabs

Eco/production buildings
Extra vision radius for Aeon
*Cybran trades HP for regen, UEF gets extra hitpoints, Aeon should have extra vision
→ 25% shouldn’t break the game
Seraphim eco/production buildings need a specialty
*There is no good reason for Seraphim to get less extra hitpoints than UEF if they don’t have a special feature in these buildings
→ Factories could store more mass than other factions’ do


PS. Make Titans worth it please.

[NapSpan]

Make Titans worth it please

Having dreams is free...

[Wesmania]

I don't think sera mobile AA needs muzzle velocity upgrade, you should go for early T2 as Seraphim early anyway. I don't see anyone complaining about Cybran t1 AA's abysmal muzzle velocity either.

[FtXCommando]

I don't think sera mobile AA needs muzzle velocity upgrade, you should go for early T2 as Seraphim early anyway. I don't see anyone complaining about Cybran t1 AA's abysmal muzzle velocity either.

Clearly you haven't heard the resurgent "mercy is op" meme; very popular among Cybran players that are allergic to air factories.

[JoonasTo]

I don't think sera mobile AA needs muzzle velocity upgrade, you should go for early T2 as Seraphim early anyway. I don't see anyone complaining about Cybran t1 AA's abysmal muzzle velocity either.

The difference is cybran darts track and thus hit, the sera ones don't and thus miss.

[Wesmania]

The difference is cybran darts track and thus hit, the sera ones don't and thus miss.

AFAIK Cybran projectile lifetime is too low to kill t2 bombers, maybe I'm mistaken.

[JoonasTo]

In my experience it's long enough, but that's versus unmicroed bombers on an attack command. Perhaps if you were to micro them so you'd drop bombs and keep flying off fullspeed without turning to come back so soon, it could be.

Tested it.
Corsairs on attack command turn just early enough to get completely screwed. They get murdered on the attack command by the AA because they stay in range and the AA just keeps targeting new ones and ripping them from the sky.
Corsairs on flyby do a lot better. The lifetime is still long enough to hit, but because they leave the range before the projectiles hit, usually only one or two bombers die since the AA keeps it's target until it's dead. In other words, the AA overkills just like the cybran cruiser.

Did some more testing with the T1 mobile AA and the aeon one is just godly in killing stuff in comparison to the others but since it dies to 3 faction's bombers I guess that's kinda the point.
The UEF isn't as bad as Seraphim but it also has problems hitting turning targets(because of the slow turret turn speed I'd imagine) that are not directly on top of it. It does murder everything flying directly to it thanks to the Alpha though so again, a tradeoff.
Looking at the stats, they should all be equal in hitting their targets(same muzzle velocity, same firing tolerance,) in fact, seraphim should be better since it should never miss(no firing randomness), so why does this happen?

[Evan_]

Seraphim eco/production buildings need a specialty
*There is no good reason for Seraphim to get less extra hitpoints than UEF if they don’t have a special feature in these buildings
→ Factories could store more mass than other factions’ do

A cool idea, but it might give them an advantage on certain maps depending on how much they store. What amount did you have in mind?

[Lieutenant Lich]

Please stop fucking with building HP or their abilities... We have enough "diversity" already...

As for the Titan, I am experimenting with it. In my mod, I add speed and increase turn rate but it will still lose to loyas. Might need to decrease cost or increase range.

[NapSpan]

Please stop fucking with building HP or their abilities... We have enough "diversity" already...

As for the Titan, I am experimenting with it. In my mod, I add speed and increase turn rate but it will still lose to loyas. Might need to decrease cost or increase range.

I could really enjoy Cheap Titans, like an upgraded Pillar, that or puting some rocket launchers in the back. Indeed the Titan being a T3 Pillar could be awesome, like same HP, damage and cost of 2 Pillars but being built faster (than now, no faster than pillars), its an improve since you dont lose damage output in your army so fast. Its just making them cheaper in energy and reducing build time