Seraphim T3 submarine

[seero]

Why we still have this unit in game?

- Named as submarine hunter, but there is no mobile navy unit which could deal with it. Whats the point?

[CrayzyNath]

Because why not?
It is meant to be a navy-counter - it's a submarine after all.

Btw: Coopers obliterate them mass to mass, its not even funny

[GrilledChicken]

Harms and Atlantis have bigger range and can both cost efficiently beat them. Since both of them are stationary units that is of course limited.
The T3 subs (especially after HP nerfs) are more of an underwater sniper bot. They are weak on defense and get slaugthered against all other anti sub fire as long as they get in range for it (well maybe not uef destroyers, but you get the point. Other destroyers, t2 subs, t1 subs, especially coopers, they all slaughter their cost equivalent of t3 subs if the enemey makes the mistake to let them get close enough).
Ground fire can work against them, if your enemey dodges it he spends time and target focus. He doesn't get his 3000 mass back very quickly if he only hits frigates. If he focuses units you can almost get a summit class's mass in a single salvo (often had it hit 3 and kill 3 in a salvo, so far not 4. That means 9000 out of 11500 i think and i got to keep the ship). All battleships outrange the t3 subs so you can always try groundfireing.
Other than that, the real counter is torpedo bombers. The enemey submarines hunters need protection vs air, either in form of ASF or swimming/hovering AA (cruiser, carrier, flak. These only do kills after the torps have been dropped). All these things, if they should be able to cover the submarines properly, would need to get close to your own navy. Close enough for your battleships/cruisers to hit them. Even if you suicide torp bomb the subs it often pays off. Air control via asf against a naval player with cruisers is expensive making it very hard to protect the subs vs suicide torp bombers.

[Plasma_Wolf]

The Atlantis doesn't win mass for mass, does it? One Atlantis has the cost of 4 subhunters. I just tested that (no micro) and two die, one takes about 30% damage before the Atlantis is dead. Oh the Atlantis also is mobile but you can just as well call it stationary by how easy it is to ground fire that thing.

Regardless, the UEF has the cooper which completely wrecks any opposing sub.

HARMs are brilliant against subs, I love them

As for the Aeon, the subhunter had a 500HP nerf a long time ago and now it has 4K hp. The Solace does exactly 4K damage. That solves all of your problems. The Solace cost is 55% of the mass of a subhunter and 230% of the energy cost. So yes, it can be that you're fielding Solaces later than subhunters if you are having trouble getting the energy supply, but other than that, it's game over for your opponent.

[Mel_Gibson]

T3 subs can quite easily beat coopers and Atlantis mass for mass if you give them even just a move order. Unless of course, UEF shield boats weren't factored for this comparison, in which case. These two are buddies also

T3 Shield.png (10.53 KiB) Viewed 3935 times

(Also goes some way to solving your suicide torp problems)

If you expect to be able to mindlessly spam t3 subs when there are torps flying about and destroyers on top of your production then yes, they are quite useless. But, like many other units, situationally they can be very useful.

[Mel_Gibson]

Lulz, just realised this thread is older than d*** van Dyke. gg wp.

Edit. Epic censor also. re gg. Hope he doesn't ever try to join faf.

[biass]

Harms and Atlantis have bigger range and can both cost efficiently beat them. Since both of them are stationary units that is of course limited.

excuse me?

[OmegaMan]

Do shields block torpedoes???

[keyser]

Yes it does

[Iszh]

Atlantis and HARMS do not have anti torpedo which is taking away quite a lot of damage. Dont underestimate this effect because t3 sub has a nice torpedo defense but only while attacking. Sera and Aeon torpedo defense work very bad if you show enemy your backside. I tested once an aeon tempest has a torpedo defense it can reduce damage of one t3 sera sub to 0 maybe even two of them.
Groudnfiring t3 subs does work but not very well if you have 30+ apm. Atlantis can be groundfired very easy thats why nobody is making atlantis in seton battleship fights. Maybe 1 or 2 simply to annoy the enemy so he has to groundfire from time to time.

T3 sub i s a very good submarine. BTW if you compare t2 subs to t1 subs i found out that t1 subs win an attackmove battle mass to mass. Thats normal they are still worse because range and speed. Thats the point about t3 subhunter. It has very high range and good speed for this dps. Additional it has a deadly aa gun.