The Seraphim Army

[yeager]

call me an idiotic noob, but I think sera utterly suck right now, normally I wouldn't say anything, but other players, even high rated ones like Briang and theeggrole seem to agree. So this thread will be devoted to suggestion on how to balance the seraphim back into the game. most people find the biggest issue in late game, but all areas are open to discussion. I guess I'll kick off the thread by suggesting that before anything else we give seraphim scu ras, plain and simple. either by incorporating the cost in or making it like the others or a combination.

[Sir Prize]

Hmm interesting. When I get the chance to play some games I'm actually going to switch over to playing Sera on ladder for a while cos I think they're good except for Othuums. And everyone plays Cybran (including me usually). I think just generally t3 land needs a nerf in comparison to t2 land so that it's not so much better. In 1v1 this would have a side effect of buffing Seraphim (probably to the point of OPness) and nerfing Aeon, so it would need to be done pretty intelligently.

I can't really comment on team game balance, which is what you must be referring to if you are talking SCU RAS balance (doesn't matter in 1v1) but the Ahwassa seems to be a game ender if you win air at the moment, going off replays.

[Reaper Zwei]

I'd go with changing the dps of the othuum's guns around first before anything else.

[speed2]

I would play seraphim on T1/T2 no problem. But once hitting T3 its bad.

Only thing you can do is in team games, troll with only sniper bots + shields. And micro your only battle. But that might be all the options for them.

Mayabe sACU with OC can do something till you have more of them, cause then you wont be able eto micro OC together with rest of the base.

And attack with Yotha and some other units = Yotha kills your units once it dies or you have to retreat.

Last option if you survive till very late game then you can abuse Asswasher with hoverbombing. (else it wont drop, happens to me 9/10 times)

[Korbah]

The fundamental issue with seraphim is one of a deficiency in racial and unit design.

The lack of a coherent theme that underpins the race has let to a litany of progressive tweaks to individual units in a long series of balance patches - the result is a disjointed and incongruous race with little synergy and even less soul.

It needs a systematic application of thematic design work to refocus and refine the race. I have a fairly clear vision of how it could be achieved and will work on it after I'm done with Air Leverage.

[yeager]

well how strong should sera t3 land be? I mean, should it be able to surpass even the uef on land? Sure that sound stupid but it's not like the other factions where they can do well at air, sera ALWAYS needs to build ground, even in air slot they will eventually do drops. so what should sera t3 be able to do?
Also I think we need to keep in mind sera's lack of units, especially when nerffing. Nerf the renagade and you nerfed 1 air to ground unit, no one will really care, but nerf the ilshavohs and you have nerfed the entire t2 land in any given game. Also people are more likely to complain because of lack of choices. if something is strong (say tac pack) It will be used EVERY GAME POSSIBLE, this is not true for the other factions, if you lose to stupid viper spam once every 50 games no one cares, but if you take away some other cybran units we would see it every game and it would most likely be nerfed.

[Vee]

The buff to othuum is far greater than the nerf to ilshie. T3 land is also a bit delayed in general. Sniper bots got buffed. Overall sera got stronger.

[yeager]

It's clearly not enough right now tho, sera is hard to bal because the need to have overpowered units (to a point) because unlike other factions thier disadvantages are much more apperent (like lack of gunship) in any given game, similarly if something is strong it will be immediately noticeable, unlike other factions. Unlike with other factions you can't say "restorer is OP, let's nerf it" with sera you need to say "ilshavohs are Op, but sera gunships suck, so let's give it a minor nerf but keep it really strong"

[keyser]

This is why we gave it a minor nerf.

[yeager]

Well overall you dropped speed from 2.9 to 2.5, and now reduced to to rate to 70 I think (I'm away on mobile so I can't check)
So over all, yeah, it was nerfed pretty hard. not necessarily sayin these nerfs are bad, but that they have made the faction useless