Thoughts on RAS

[gnatinator]

IMO, it's problematic that players can have vastly different incomes solely depending on what faction they choose.

The entire unit balance is centred around cost.

Might sound drastic, but I propose all of the resource upgrades should be normalized and made the same.

I'd go as far as to say Faction Diversity currently suffers because unit balance is dependant on the economies being the same. Example: If I get 2 mass per tick, and you only have 1 mass per tick, it doesn't matter how factionally diverse the units are because I will have 2x as many units.

[Korbah]

This all ties in with the fact that late game economy is completely under-realised. GPG deliberately made late game econ buildings explode so that the econ farms of vanilla supcom couldn't exist. Hence the entire focus is on t3mex + t3 pgens + RAS + SCU ras.


We're missing an entire portion of late game econ that would permit racial discrepancies in RAS. I don't have the answer in how to make t3 econ better or more interesting at this stage.

[Reaper Zwei]

IMO, it's problematic that players can have vastly different incomes solely depending on what faction they choose.

The entire unit balance is centred around cost.

Might sound drastic, but I propose all of the resource upgrades should be normalized and made the same.

I'd go as far as to say Faction Diversity currently suffers because unit balance is dependant on the economies being the same. Example: If I get 2 mass per tick, and you only have 1 mass per tick, it doesn't matter how factionally diverse the units are because I will have 2x as many units.

If it was truly making that much of a difference we would be seeing people especially pro's pick which faction they play based mostly on who gets more with ras. Are we seeing that? 'Cause I don't think we are.

[zeroAPM]

IMO, it's problematic that players can have vastly different incomes solely depending on what faction they choose.

The entire unit balance is centred around cost.

Might sound drastic, but I propose all of the resource upgrades should be normalized and made the same.

I'd go as far as to say Faction Diversity currently suffers because unit balance is dependant on the economies being the same. Example: If I get 2 mass per tick, and you only have 1 mass per tick, it doesn't matter how factionally diverse the units are because I will have 2x as many units.

If it was truly making that much of a difference we would be seeing people especially pro's pick which faction they play based mostly on who gets more with ras. Are we seeing that? 'Cause I don't think we are.

Air spot=Aeon only because of double RAS

[ZeRen]

IMO, it's problematic that players can have vastly different incomes solely depending on what faction they choose.

The entire unit balance is centred around cost.

Might sound drastic, but I propose all of the resource upgrades should be normalized and made the same.

I'd go as far as to say Faction Diversity currently suffers because unit balance is dependant on the economies being the same. Example: If I get 2 mass per tick, and you only have 1 mass per tick, it doesn't matter how factionally diverse the units are because I will have 2x as many units.

If it was truly making that much of a difference we would be seeing people especially pro's pick which faction they play based mostly on who gets more with ras. Are we seeing that? 'Cause I don't think we are.

Air spot=Aeon only because of double RAS

why not sera then ?

it is not just about double RAS...

[Iszh]

mercy

i play uef and if you know how to built your factories it s no problem not to have double ras but you need to optimize your base from begin of the game to get t3 air fac t3 pgen mix easy and fast. The only imba thing about ras is the built power. To reach the same like double ras i need tons of t1 engis to move arround and upgrade a fast t3 mex and at the same time built 1 t3 pgen. Roll off time from t3 fac and so on this shit takes ethernal and in this time ras is already finised for a long time.
Solution atm is you need to rush bomber with 1 ras faction and then spam a few asf to protect yourself then immidiately go t3 engi and hurry with all built power you can to establish t3 air fac and t3 pgen mix.

My proposal as average joe air player is to increase the built power so much that it will be difficult to reach ras even with assist of 20 engis so fast like now. I guess that means something like 10 times more needed built power compared to now.

[keyser]

aeon is often take at air spot because : double ras, swift wings, mercy... (good damage strat against noobs)

i would say swift wings is the best argument for aeon at air spot, because it allow you to stop bomber without T3 air.

[Iszh]

i thought mercy is more reason because you can kill exp units and rusing acus like no other faction. Swift wind theory would support the idea of my mod to increase speed and aa dps of fighter bombers so other factions would be able to fight t3 bombers with t2 fighter bombers. The aa dps was increased with huge overkill so they dont have any advantage vs t1 planes or swift winds. I think zock was even interested in this idea but meanwhile it seems impossible to test my mod since the balance mod is now rated and with my mod it is not rated anymore. Before was more easy to make additional tests. I even had like 5 games in a row with 1 version of my mod but this difference is so minimal that those tests didnt really show something.

[Gorton]

It would be interesting if the buildtime of ARAS was significantly increased to compensate.

Then again, i'm not really sure this is a problem. A minor one perhaps, but realistically it's factional differences.

[yeager]

Honestly ras and aras is fine, if you want only units themselves to be different and have the means of getting them equal among all factions you need to: give sera reg scu ras, make all acu ras equal, take out engi stations (better build power= easier to build units) take out sparky, the build suite on fatboy, and mega, give uef a reg aircraft carrier and take off the build suite on the atlantis etc. i think the idea behind this is sera and aeon get ras while cybran and uef get engi stations, which is a pretty fair trade off except in really long games. also if your choosing your air player based on ras or aras then sera is the best choice, it give you way more energy for only 2 less mass a tic and means you can get more early asf out