T3 Air

[Myxir]

If the problem is that ASF are the only effective counters to T3/T4 air threats, and SAMs are static and expensive, what effect would a mobile SAM launcher have?

they are actually very cheap if you consider that they can always shoot when something is in range, unlike an asf (it has to face the right direction), also sams have splash

Since this might imbalance land forces, what about giving SAM's a much longer range?

wouldn't protect your ships from a soul ripper

[pip]

If the problem is that ASF are the only effective counters to T3/T4 air threats, and SAMs are static and expensive, what effect would a mobile SAM launcher have?

Mobile SAMs is the solution that makes the most sense in my opinion because it solves the probelm that ASF are their own counter outside of a base, and because this approach doesn't require to change lot of air and anti-air static units, nor to rework ASF over and over. It's possible to improve the situation by other means (improve, not fix), but I just can't think of a more elegant way to fix the situation than adding mobile t3 aa units.

NB: Mobile SAMS were added in the community balance patch 6 years ago. But it was just a mod (not official) and made just before 3603 was released, so it became obsolete due to 3603 release, because 3603 itself was a mod an not used as stock game in GPGnet (beta patch). So the community balance patch and its mobile SAMS never got to be used as a standard.
6 years later, maybe 75% of the ideas / fixes included in the community balance patch that was not adressed in 3603 slowly made its way to FAF (more than 150 bugfixes, naval adjustments, firebeetle improvements, SCU improvements and more). FAF actually went much, much further to improve the game, but is still behind concerning the mobile SAM topic. Maybe with FAF it's a new opportunity to resurect and polish them.

[Cantor]

I agree with pip here. Note that cybran already have something like a mobile SAM with the nanite AA upgrade on the SCU, but it is a bad SAM for its price since it doesn't have splash and is expensive. If zep is very much against adding new units, one possibility would be giving all factions an AA upgrade on the SCU and buffing it, but IMO mobile sams would be better.

[IceDreamer]

I agree with pip 100%, Mobile T3 AA is the best way to solve this hands down. I just assumed it was out because making the model, balancing it, getting faction diversity in etc takes longer than the scope of this balance patch.

[Shadow Night Black]

I agree with pip 100%, Mobile T3 AA is the best way to solve this hands down. I just assumed it was out because making the model, balancing it, getting faction diversity in etc takes longer than the scope of this balance patch.

Then ask to use the Blackops T3 mobile anti air?

[pip]

I agree with pip 100%, Mobile T3 AA is the best way to solve this hands down. I just assumed it was out because making the model, balancing it, getting faction diversity in etc takes longer than the scope of this balance patch.

The models were made 6 years ago, even before Black Ops was half finished. They were made by Kirvesnaama as a separate mod but intended for the community balance patch of which they were a part. They are GPG quality with faction diversity. Only their balancing would need adjusting because of the changes made to FAF since 3599 days.

So far, Pilot has been very reluctant to add other units, and I am too, except for this one case, becaue of that specific issue which has been noticed, discussed ad nauseam since FA launch. Nothing good enough could be done so far : the situation is clearly better, but still not fully fixed, otherwise, we wouldn't be still discussing this after all these years... .

[Ato0theJ]

Like I said in my first post, the only way to add create a new counter to ASF without changing the dynamic of existing units is to add a t3 mobile flak unit for all factions. Slowly adding new units that fit the style of the game will only make it better. Some areas of the game are severely limited to the units provided by GPG. IE: No mobile factory or naval experimentals for Seraphim while Aeon has 2 and the others have 1, no naval AA units for cybran with splash while seraphim has 2 and others have 1, no t3 gunship for seraphim while all of the others have one, no special t3 unit for cybran navy, etc, etc. I'm all for faction diversity, but at least a few of these are just unfair for the factions.

[The Mak]

I agree with pip 100%, Mobile T3 AA is the best way to solve this hands down. I just assumed it was out because making the model, balancing it, getting faction diversity in etc takes longer than the scope of this balance patch.

Then ask to use the Blackops T3 mobile anti air?

Actually, Kirvesnaama created those excellent mobile T3AA units and I believe the Blackops asked to use them in their mod.

I vote with the sentiment that mobile T3AA units such as Kirvesnaama is long, long overdue.

[pip]

Like I said in my first post, the only way to add create a new counter to ASF without changing the dynamic of existing units is to add a t3 mobile flak unit for all factions. Slowly adding new units that fit the style of the game will only make it better. Some areas of the game are severely limited to the units provided by GPG. IE: No mobile factory or naval experimentals for Seraphim while Aeon has 2 and the others have 1, no naval AA units for cybran with splash while seraphim has 2 and others have 1, no t3 gunship for seraphim while all of the others have one, no special t3 unit for cybran navy, etc, etc. I'm all for faction diversity, but at least a few of these are just unfair for the factions.

It's not sure yet that T3 mobile AA will be the chosen solution and that Pilot will allow them to be included in FAF. But he clearly said he's against adding any new units to FAF and it's most likely out of the question that any other new units would be even considered to be added to FAF (otherwise, it would never end, like what happened with TA mods). Mobile SAM would be, and should be IMO, the only possible exception. The game is plenty rich enough to allow a small asymetrical unit distribution without being unbalanced overall.

Be warned : asking for other units is the best way to prevent Zep for greenlighting t3 mobile AA in FAF. There are mods for this like Black Ops, etc.

[tdrqwako]

Better to make asf use lots of fuel so that to have many asf operational one will need to create a whole infrastructure with aircraftcarriers/ air staging facilities.