Czar air micro & Restos OP

[Casimus]

EDIT - realised it wasnt balance test ignore.

[Gorton]

Against the restorers... use flak. If someone's going to bunch their units together, exploit that.
I think it's the build time that needs to be looked at rather than health to be honest.
http://faforever.com/faf/unitsDB/unit.p ... 05,UAA0303

[Casimus]

Against the restorers... use flak. If someone's going to bunch their units together, exploit that.
I think it's the build time that needs to be looked at rather than health to be honest.
http://faforever.com/faf/unitsDB/unit.p ... 05,UAA0303

Air Superiority Fighters not being superior in an air battle is a bit of a paradox don't you think. 150 asf with good micro should smash 60 Restos but that doesnt happen.

[pip]

The Restorer is a AA gunship, it should be able to kill ASF. What is wrong is that it is also super efficient against ground targets, especially in high numbers (10+).

[Gorton]

Against the restorers... use flak. If someone's going to bunch their units together, exploit that.
I think it's the build time that needs to be looked at rather than health to be honest.
http://faforever.com/faf/unitsDB/unit.p ... 05,UAA0303

Air Superiority Fighters not being superior in an air battle is a bit of a paradox don't you think. 150 asf with good micro should smash 60 Restos but that doesnt happen.

Mass for mass, they are. It's 4 ASF to a restorer. They should win; it's just the build time for restorers means you get 1 for every 1 and a 1/2 ASF.
It's the exact same thing people were talking about for the continental, which had the same issue.
Edit: Well, actually about 3 and a half ASF to one rest mass for mass.

Edit: Pip also makes a good point in that they are supposed to be AA. Want a counter? Use flak.

[Hawkei]

The Restorer is a AA gunship, it should be able to kill ASF. What is wrong is that it is also super efficient against ground targets, especially in high numbers (10+).

Well actually, they are an AA gunship. They are supposed to be lethal, but not OP against ASF. They already do have disadvantages in mobility. and they are not the most efficient ground fire unit. It is a tentative balance, because, AA is the primary feature of the restorer. Nerfing it would lead to them being usless... I think they are supposed to hurt ASF, and beat them in superior numbers. But loose in an even fight. The current balance is good.

The current speed is also good. As the mobility tradeoff allows them to fullfill their primary function (organic AA) without challenging the Air-space Control of the ASF. Restorers can only ever control a small region of airspace. ASF can control significant potions of the map. It is a big difference. The units already are balanced.

[Ze_PilOt]

They are hardly OP against ASF.

[pip]

If anything, they are UP against ASF, but overally OP due to good anti-air + good anti-ground + cheap price + high HP combo.
As a jack of all trades, they end up being the best t3 gunship because you can keep them alive much longer. It's not uncommon to see 30 Restorers. Have you ever seen 30 Broadswords?
I wish Restorers had better AA (same as Continentals) and worse anti-ground DPS (same as a t2 gunship).

Also, the other t3 gunships are probably UP too (at least too slow, considering the fact that they can't defend themselves).

[Casimus]

They are hardly OP against ASF.

I beg to differ and I can supply many replays as proof of this if you will consider a change.

The problem will come now that in order to compete with mass resto spamming people will have to either mix navy else UEF and Cybran cannot be considered. I agree on land flak is more than capable of dealing with Restos and that has never been an issue, navy on the other hand is quite different.

Note this has only reared its ugly head once more since the ASF nerf, I would propose either a small health reduction for Restos or a reduction in their AA capability.

[Ze_PilOt]

ASF can beat restorer mass for mass (3.5 ASF for one restorer) I don't see how you can provide a replay that prove otherwise, we did many tests on this.

But well, if you can provide a replay of 10 restorers beating 35 ASF, why not.