Auto Recall

Re: Auto Recall

Postby Iszh » 04 Feb 2014, 08:23

Thats very complicated systems you are offering here sometimes. Lets see the problem is that you can use your acu like in normal 1v1 ladder game. You take it and go attack the enemy. Thats supcom and it is needed. On small maps especially there are some where i can tell you when 2 equl good players play then "no acu no fight" you will lose for sure if you dont use your acu aggressive. SO i think it is part of the game and should stay. On one hand now you tell that the reinforcements replace the acu but thats somehow not the same. I still would like to play like in a ladder game sometimes with acu attacking. So i liked the autorecall system a lot and i think basically it can stay like it is. It is great since it is even better then an acu kill for the winner. Hills of credits for the enemy.

But i was frustrated in this way that we also have people with low rating in our team, i dont want to punish them but those people are punishing me. They buy with level 2 autorecall or simply level up insane and use autorecall all the time with a win rate of 20%. Enemies dont know anymore how to spent their credits ... i had a battle against to 2k rating people together with a 700 rating i was attacking the planet. They knew they would win without efforts, nvertheless they called just for fun insane reinforcements. We had to recal there was not even the smallest chance. Of course they lost credits for this game, but just by killing some bad autorecall high rank people they can attack in the next fights nearly with diamond&gold acu. The autorecall AND the ranking up should be earned somehow and not so easy reachable for simply anybody in my opinion not to feed the enemies with endlesss credits. They can ask the good players for reinforcements any time.

But when it is limited that only good players can reach autorecall then beginners will be in endless loop of destruction and never reach anything. Maybe there should be established a system which automtically forces people to rank up in different ranks and stay there.

An example:
We want to reach the effekt that under 1000 rating people will stay rank 1-3
People between 1000 and 1500 will stay 4-5
And only 1500+ people will be 6-8

To reach such an effekt you can make difference for auto recall on every stage. I will take my win counter example here just to explain no idea if that would be a good solution it is just an example in this case.

When you are rank 1-3 you can buy for 1 victory 3 autorecall
When you are rank 4-5 you can buy 1 autorecall per victory
When you are rank 6-8 you can buy 1 autorecall for 3 wins

Btw there should be added a number next to the autorecalls to show how many you have :)
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Dragonfire » 04 Feb 2014, 09:36

Iszh wrote:Thats very complicated systems you are offering here sometimes. Lets see the problem is that you can use your acu like in normal 1v1 ladder game. You take it and go attack the enemy. Thats supcom and it is needed. On small maps especially there are some where i can tell you when 2 equl good players play then "no acu no fight" you will lose for sure if you dont use your acu aggressive. SO i think it is part of the game and should stay. On one hand now you tell that the reinforcements replace the acu but thats somehow not the same. I still would like to play like in a ladder game sometimes with acu attacking. So i liked the autorecall system a lot and i think basically it can stay like it is. It is great since it is even better then an acu kill for the winner. Hills of credits for the enemy.

But i was frustrated in this way that we also have people with low rating in our team, i dont want to punish them but those people are punishing me. They buy with level 2 autorecall or simply level up insane and use autorecall all the time with a win rate of 20%. Enemies dont know anymore how to spent their credits ... i had a battle against to 2k rating people together with a 700 rating i was attacking the planet. They knew they would win without efforts, nvertheless they called just for fun insane reinforcements. We had to recal there was not even the smallest chance. Of course they lost credits for this game, but just by killing some bad autorecall high rank people they can attack in the next fights nearly with diamond&gold acu. The autorecall AND the ranking up should be earned somehow and not so easy reachable for simply anybody in my opinion not to feed the enemies with endlesss credits. They can ask the good players for reinforcements any time.

But when it is limited that only good players can reach autorecall then beginners will be in endless loop of destruction and never reach anything. Maybe there should be established a system which automtically forces people to rank up in different ranks and stay there.

An example:
We want to reach the effekt that under 1000 rating people will stay rank 1-3
People between 1000 and 1500 will stay 4-5
And only 1500+ people will be 6-8

To reach such an effekt you can make difference for auto recall on every stage. I will take my win counter example here just to explain no idea if that would be a good solution it is just an example in this case.

When you are rank 1-3 you can buy for 1 victory 3 autorecall
When you are rank 4-5 you can buy 1 autorecall per victory
When you are rank 6-8 you can buy 1 autorecall for 3 wins

Btw there should be added a number next to the autorecalls to show how many you have :)


Maybe a good idea is a skill tree, instead of flat flat level system ...
Which each level you can inveest points into skills, like autorecall, reinforcements, ...

A good side effect ... you can limit the skill investement ... e.g. only x player of each faction can skill t3 reinforcements.
If you inactive, you lose the skill until the next galactic war period and somebody else can skill it.
Maybe for credits you can also change skills ...
My native language is not english, please correct me, because I want to improve my skills # Resource Overview
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Szakalot » 04 Feb 2014, 10:07

Thats a nice idea but sounds like a whole new meta game to be introduced. I think in the meantime winning autorecalls that scale with your rank is the most feasible proposition that wouldn't limit gameplay.

I think the core mechanic here is to get the credits out of auto recall, as if its about money - players will always wait until they have enough to buy one, before playing.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby theManfet » 05 Feb 2014, 22:21

Imho that is all too nice.
I think playing GW should be different to playing in Ladder.
And with autorecall and this proposed numbers it is not different. 1 Autorecall for 3 Wins.... I can reach that easily. And I am ranked under 1500 in global rating.
Imho having no autorecall is the best solution.
1. it makes keeping an high ranked avatar really difficult as it should be imho. right now there are only rank4 and above out there. only some rare noobs are privates.
2. no autorecall and still playing aggressive is quite a risk to take but it could pay off back then. I went ACU vs ACU often enough with a Rank4. Yeah it was dangerous. but if wouldn't have I would have lost because I am too bad in FA. I took the higher risk and made it through anyway. I even got to rank 7 back then.
3. because everybody tried to snipe high ranking people it even appealed to the person to stay low in ranking because it was easier to play them
4. Ranking in normal life means veterancy and skill - right now ranking only means "veterancy" in a very small sense. back then you could trust somebody with high rank to know his stuff.
5. punishing autorecall with high credits for the opponent. this just doesn't work. A small noob who rarely plays doesn't care about it. He wants to have some fun and tries to get it. He does not really care about his faction enough to learn and understand how this whole system works. the charging and needing 24h for the next autorecall doesn't work either. There are many people out there who only play one game per day.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Ato0theJ » 05 Feb 2014, 23:31

Iszh wrote:Increasing the cost will as voodoo explained only lead to waiting, i agree fully that this is absolutely not helpful. I think there is another solution needed for example like i explained above.



What's wrong with waiting? That effectively takes that commander out of service until they can get enough credits to buy another one. Isn't that the whole point of trying to kill a high ranked commander?

Iszh wrote:
An example:
We want to reach the effekt that under 1000 rating people will stay rank 1-3
People between 1000 and 1500 will stay 4-5
And only 1500+ people will be 6-8



One of the major objectives of GW was to allow low rated players to play with the best players. All this does is gimps players that don't do a lot of ranked matches. There will be a reason to 'boost' for rating in FAF if this is implemented.


Okay, should variable costs not be a good solution to the Auto-recall issue, how about if auto-recalls were given out every X amount of days. The amount of days should depend on your rank. This would limit high rank players from having easily disposable autorecalls and allow for newbies to hold onto their coms for longer.

High rank players should be punished more for losing an autorecall than lower ones. There is much more importance in keeping a high ranked avatar alive and the availability of autorecalls should reflect that. If winning a game by autorecall didn't give extra credits, killing lots of low rank players with autorecall will no longer be an issue for the other team because it woudn't be such a massive credit feed to the other teams.

Auto-recalls need to be valuable assets to a high rank commander, making them wait for another one will reward the other factions for taking out the highly rated avatar.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Hawkei » 06 Feb 2014, 05:31

theManfet wrote:Imho that is all too nice.
I think playing GW should be different to playing in Ladder.

... the charging and needing 24h for the next autorecall doesn't work either. There are many people out there who only play one game per day.

I do think that auto-recall should exist in the game. The negative impact on gameplay from the no auto-recall situation was a lack of high level player involvement. level 4 and 5 players were little more than "milk-cows" who would offload T3 reinforcements to level 2's. Auto-recall allows these players to participate more.

I still don't see why my idea of a 24hr cool down is a bad one. Essentially, when auto-recall is used, the player will be faced with an immediate dilemma. If they participate in any further operations in the next 24hrs it could be a KO. Which means they either:

1. Withdraw from GW for 24hrs;
2. Continue with operations - and take the risk.

This dilemma would make an auto-recall a serious blow. Say for instance a star player is involved in an assault team or defence team and there are several ongoing attacks. Having this player withdraw from combat will give his opponents 24hrs to do as they wish - without fear of further interference.

In situations where this player had a key role this could force his team to abandon their mission. If the situation is dire, the player might be forced to risk their avatar. But everyone on the opposing team will know that his next loss will be a KO. I think 24hr cool down strikes the right balance between security and vulnerability.
Last edited by Hawkei on 06 Feb 2014, 07:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Hawkei » 06 Feb 2014, 07:19

I also recommend two levels of auto-recall. Level 3 and 4 characters only having access to slower version of auto-recall. It would take 2 seconds to activate so it would protect an ACU only from certain threat types. It would not prevent alpha strike kills such as TML's or Air-snipes, T4, or any other attack which can do 1000 damage within a 2 second window. Only level 5 to 8's would have access to the current version of auto-recall. I would recommend something like;

Auto-recall - 1500cr cost (unlocked at level 3, single time purchase, 24hr cool off, 1000 HP threshold, 2 sec activation time, in-game toggle button to disable)
Advanced Auto-recall - 3500cr cost (unlocked at level 5, single time purchase, requires Auto-recall as pre-requisite, 24hr cool off, 0 HP threshold, instantaneous activation)
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Iszh » 06 Feb 2014, 08:26

I ve been against all measure which would make people wait. GW is not made for waiting, people should play actively as much as possible thats the target. So the limit should be anything else then time. No cooldown on Autorecall no other things which could propably make people wait. GW is meant as fighting for the universe not for circling free planets.

You tell me that 3 win per 1 autorecall is not enough, no problem so we increase the numbers watch the picture thats an offer.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Hawkei » 06 Feb 2014, 08:44

What about subtracting losses from your win counter? That way if you never have >50% win ratio you will not be able to level up.
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Re: Auto Recall

Postby Iszh » 06 Feb 2014, 09:36

No, because losses automatically cost victory points if you use autorecall thats enough. You would make it impossible to rank up thats not the plan.
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