Re-think dead is dead

[rkrempel]

I had most of the same concerns as Sheppard has, and for mostly the same reasons, but i still voted "yes"on the poll.

Most concerns listed are not with dead=dead, but with the effects of (losing) rank. Since the rank-based abilities are not yet set, it may yet be too early to worry, annoying as it may be for the moment. To me, rank is way to much like an RPG level right now, which makes no sense to me. Is this really needed? Isn't being called General or Avatar-of-War already a reward of its own? There will be (I'm assuming) a social interaction component to GW, so the titles themselves are not meaningless (even if they are right now).

On a similar note, will rank even remain fixed on # of victories? Even if so, will these remain static limits, or could it be something more complex like "% of all victories by a faction" and/or "# victories in the last week/month"?. All those are possible solutions to get some social mobility going. Indeed, we need to prevent people from clinging to unto their seats too much, but this has nothing to do with dead=dead. If anything, death is a great promoter of social mobility (I just thought of something... an easy way to gain rank may be to tml your superior ). Ultimately, we could let characters die or retire from old age after a while, so that not taking any risks will get you only so far.

It is true that, in many other meta-games, long term motivation is important. But, is it really? I'm very happy I stopped playing the xp farming genre a long time ago. If at all possible, GW should be devoid of any such mechanics. I'm not so sure the typical RTS player is all that concerned with long term motivation.

Finally, I agree dead=dead will scare off some people, but I also think its worth to try it out to its fullest first. If it really doesn't work, then we can look into "dead=very annoying" or "dead=somewhat meaningless" options.

[Ze_PilOt]

The goal is that I want GW to play differently than FA.

By making death a real problem, you have to be more careful where to attack, what to bring with, analyze the battle, redraw when needed, and not run into the opponent base at minute 3.

If I remove that, it's just another way to launch custom game, with a reinforcement mod on top of it.

Also, your concerns are not really concerns. There is no XP to grind at all.

And stop thinking that players are dumbs and want casual games. They are playing FA to begin with.

Anyway, I won't change it, that's the core mechanic of GW, topic closed.

[rkrempel]

Also, your concerns are not really concerns. There is no XP to grind at all.

That REALLY is what getting victories feels like right now though...

[Ze_PilOt]

For the ... I don't count anymore : Nothing is set. I've put some numbers so I can see if things are working or not.

In the beta, it will be tweaked. By the way, it's already tweaked in the last patch : Rank 1 need just money, and then it's 10,20,30,40 .. victories, to avoid grinding ranks just by waiting for money.

If I remove the victories conditions, there is no real need to attack or defend. It's needed, unless you have a better idea (that doesn't involve redesigning the whole game, because it won't happen, too late and no time for that anymore).
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[Ze_PilOt]

Also, lot of upcoming features are revolving around the fact that dying is dying, like man-hunting.

And you can't seriously say that ranking up is a long term investment and that is hard to rank.

You need, currently, about 3 days to get to a level where all the upgrades are unlocked. (unless you play like a dumb and die every two games, but then you probably need to re-think how you play instead of blaming the system .

And if you are away, you are auto-recalled, so no more dying for nothing.

[Ze_PilOt]

Even if so, will these remain static limits, or could it be something more complex.

I think I've already written that it will depend of how many players are in your factions, how many planets you know, and obviously how many high(er) ranked players you have.

Same for money generation.

an easy way to gain rank may be to tml your superior

Actually a viable way, as the last two ranks are reserved for 2 players only (and I've though of that while deciding it).

It's up to you to make your own dynamic.
There will be a manhunting function where you can put a price on the head of someone. Can be someone on your faction. You can even contact the enemy to trap him in a 3v3 where you fight against him.