ASFs, lag, What can be done...

[IceDreamer]

So I've started thinking about the fact that massive late-game ASF battles (Usually on Setons) cause a disproportionately large decline in simspeed, and wondering what can be done about it, if anything.

1: The problem - It's a combination of three things. First, the sheer number of ASFs which are commonly produced. Unlike other units it is not uncommon to see 300 VS 300 of these things. Second, the incredible number of projectiles kicked out in these battles. This is the biggest culprit. Last balance patch the number of projectiles was cut in half, which has definitely helped things, but the problem persists. Third, with such large numbers of planes involved, the game is constantly checking available targets, the list of which is constantly changing as targets die or go out of range.

2: My objective - This is a discussion of concepts, of overarching schemes which we might explore or test to see if the lag can be reduced. It is not a balance change. I accept that balance will inevitably change whenever anything else changes, but a major aim here is to keep any shift in balance as small as possible, keep the gameplay the same. If you're going to object to everything on the basis that it changes balance, get out, it's not constructive. I don't know if it's even possible to reduce this lag without wrecking everything around it, but I do think it's worth a shot. I need legitimate problems pointed out. I need ideas for alternative approaches. I do not need you to say "This won't work" or "This cannot be done"; I know that's a possibility, saying it is just pointless.

3: Current approach - So this is the only thing I can see so far, reduce the number of ASFs in play, as far as possible without touching the way they play or the balance... So to give a start point we have...

Double HP
Double Damage
Double Mass
Double Energy
Double BuildTime

Potential downsides:

Higher frontloadedness might mark a tiny power jump VS low-tech units
First ASF comes out fractionally later
ASFs much less vulnerable to Flack


What have I missed? If you have an entirely different idea for killing the lag, do share.

[E8400-CV]

What have I missed? If you have an entirely different idea for killing the lag, do share.

People should just buy a CPU from this decade... one with proper single thread performance and not an 8*nothing from AMD.

Heck, even a Core i3 4130 will run this game just fine, including the 500 ASF fights.

And if you want to talk about killing lag you definitely should not add the .05 to facilitate those that still don't use slave factories. Perhaps better triple the roll-off time. Then we might perhaps finally see the 500 T1 engies for air production some still use once and for all replaced by 20 slave factories.

[IceDreamer]

Air factory has no rolloff time as such, it's just a gap caused by the scripts running through to the next build queue for 1 tick. Galacticfear has pointed it out as not being needed too, though, so that's gone.

And do some research. Having tested 500 vs 500 on a 4.8GHz SB i7 last week, during these fights the sim drops to -6 or -7. It's a problem.

[E8400-CV]

The 500 I meant was 250 v 250; a more likely occurrence.

Most game slowdowns in the <1600 rated games are present w/o any ASF fights; someone playing on the toaster.

I don't think much can be changed anymore without affecting balance a lot. Also; if ASF cost double, their wrecks contain twice as much mass; making it much more useful to manually reclaim them.

And could you please not edit your post after I respond to a part!? Now it looks plain silly. Meaning; you removed this:

Multiply BuildTime by 2.05 (The extra 0.05 is because we are trying to make every one of these ASFs = two current ASFs. That little bit extra takes into account the tiny gap in time between one ASF being completed in a highly-assisted factory, and the next beginning)

[pip]

You can try anything you want, as long as ASF is the only way to counter t3 / t4 air, they will be spammed on Seton. Adding t3 mobile AA as an alternative to ASF is a deep enough change to reduce ASF spam habits. There is a mod in the mod vault with t3 mobile sams, intended for Seton tests, but Seton players love their ASF spam, so they never cared about it.

[IceDreamer]

Oh sorry, shoulda just turned it red. I removed it because you and gala convinced me it wasn't the best idea

And pip I know what you mean, but I'm not trying to change the ASF spam habit with this. Players will still be dumping as much eco as now into them, but there will just be fewer planes produced. I'm hoping it will make a difference, no idea really though

[The Mak]

What about reducing their speed? Top speed is 25, why not drop that down to 15-20 and all other faster aircraft down by the same multiplier. This way they are more susceptible to AA and those quick snipes may not be so feasible anymore.

I also agree with pip, there needs to be more mobile options to deal with air other than just air.

[E8400-CV]

Lol no; it will remove any sense of reality from the game.

[IceDreamer]

That would be a balance change, which this isn't.

[IceDreamer]

Attempt 1 uploaded as ASF Lag Reduction