A thought about mass fabs

[Apofenas]

I saw some topics on FAF forums about making mass fabricators more useable. Most ideas were about reducing cost of mass fabs or energy cost of its usage(or increasing mass income), but i think, 1 mass for 150 energy is balanced and fabs have fair cost. So changing anything may force a lot of tutrling.

Main idea:I suggest to remove mass income at all, reduce energy outcome, for example, to 75 and make a huge buff to its adjacency bonus (i think 60% for surrounding buildings). This would mean that mass will come directly into units or structure upgrades. (My numbers here may not be correct)

Developing this idea: I suggest to add to mass fabs ability of mass storages (increasing mass income of mass extractors) or add to mass storages an upgrade to t2 mass fabs (making mass fabricator a t2 stage of mass storage, but that would mean to change the design of fabs or storages)

[Marko Box]

What about naval facs? Cant build mass fabs araund them.

[Lionhardt]

How is this an argument? You cant build any adjacency bonus giving structures around them.


While I like the idea of making mass fabs adjacency bonus only things, I don't think it would be good to substitute mass fabs with these redone mass fabs. There are in fact some maps, where T2 mass fabs are needed, all be it those maps are very special. Flat is such a map. You got only one Mass spot very player and without t2 mass fabs it would be much harder to get an eco going that allows you to start building up t3 ress-gens.

[Apofenas]

How is this an argument? You cant build any adjacency bonus giving structures around them.


While I like the idea of making mass fabs adjacency bonus only things, I don't think it would be good to substitute mass fabs with these redone mass fabs. There are in fact some maps, where T2 mass fabs are needed, all be it those maps are very special. Flat is such a map. You got only one Mass spot very player and without t2 mass fabs it would be much harder to get an eco going that allows you to start building up t3 ress-gens.

This idea came to mind, when I was playing on Sludge. There were 4 mass spots close to each other, so i had huge adjacency bonus upgrading mass extractors. Then i tryed to do same thing with one MEX surrounded with mass fabs. It was terrible. Bonus was less than 30%. So to get those 30% for factory means to spend 1600 mass, 64000 energy (which is already a lot) and get outcome of 2400 energy (even with 16 mass income), so you have to get about 5 t2 powe generators only to support them (total 6000 mass and 60000 energy). This is huge investment even for 100% bonus. Thats why i suggested to reduce energy outcome, but 1 mass for 150 energy is fair, thats why i suggested to remove mass income, so you will get even more mass with bonus. Still it would be nice to have a bit different adjacency system, so you would get bonus of 1 mass (not %) for mass fab.

As for maps like Flat, they usually played with Black ops, so my suggestion doesn't affect them (I have never played them without some mods).

[Lionhardt]

With "How is this an argument?" I was referring to Marko Box, in case you misonderstood this...

[Swkoll]

How is this an argument? You cant build any adjacency bonus giving structures around them.


While I like the idea of making mass fabs adjacency bonus only things, I don't think it would be good to substitute mass fabs with these redone mass fabs. There are in fact some maps, where T2 mass fabs are needed, all be it those maps are very special. Flat is such a map. You got only one Mass spot very player and without t2 mass fabs it would be much harder to get an eco going that allows you to start building up t3 ress-gens.

The day we start balancing around flat is the day balance dies an unholy death.

[CenturionSlayer]

I like the idea of Mass fabs being something like a mass storage.

Storage = warehouse
fab = processing facility

We could think of the energy consumption by the fab as going towards the production of the extra mass in addition to an adjacency bonus.

Juice it too much though and its Turtle City all over again, but its obvious that something needs to be done, and I think we should start by adding a small or equivalent(not 100% on this, idk) storage ability for the fab. T3 fabs could store a ton of mass.

Storage currently holds 500 Mass
Maybe Fabs could hold 250? 100?
T3 could hold 5000?
Basically make it more expensive than a t1 storage, use energy, and maybe we will see people place them around mexes instead of storages in mid/late games

What are other people thinking about this

[Apofenas]

I like the idea of Mass fabs being something like a mass storage.

Storage = warehouse
fab = processing facility

We could think of the energy consumption by the fab as going towards the production of the extra mass in addition to an adjacency bonus.

Juice it too much though and its Turtle City all over again, but its obvious that something needs to be done, and I think we should start by adding a small or equivalent(not 100% on this, idk) storage ability for the fab. T3 fabs could store a ton of mass.

Storage currently holds 500 Mass
Maybe Fabs could hold 250? 100?
T3 could hold 5000?
Basically make it more expensive than a t1 storage, use energy, and maybe we will see people place them around mexes instead of storages in mid/late games

What are other people thinking about this

I think 100 mass for t2 fab is fair enought, because factories can hold some mass as well (t1 - 80 mass; unit database has no information about storages of t2 and t3).