TVG mod

[GuardPatroller]

I was mainly just wondering about tvg and why it wasn't here already... Or I apologize if in my scan for it I've missed over one.

This is what it is: http://forums.gaspowered.com/viewtopic.php?t=40012http://forums.gaspowered.com/viewtopic.php?t=40012
Here's a one sentence summary before I go into evaluation time...
In TVG, your units, weapons and factories grow and become stronger, so now there's a reason to keep them. They gain XP for killing, keeping up a shield, building, and producing resources. If you keep a T2 shield from the beginning of the game, it becomes quite powerful in the late game, if too powerful which I'll address later. TVG attempts to fix that anticlimactic screwup of the game where, after both evenly matched players have huge bases that took 45 minutes of micromanagement to get to maximum efficiency, one player sends an assassination fleet through some hole in land or air base defense through the shields to kill that 12,000hp ACU.

It does this by allowing the ACU to level up with an average of +10% to stats at each level. L11=double power. I love talking strategy, and this is what I'm doing, but first you need background info, right? (I shouldn't need to go into details about the exact mannerisms and properties of leveling up, it's on the link up there.) *Level changers differ in Single player and Multiplayer*

Maybe that assassination is great and fun for most of you, but it leaves me with a sad, empty feeling. All this base and work done just to be exposed for a microsecond and killed on a dime. Therefore, I have made a pros and cons list.
PROS
-Better build speed per level helps in base construction
-Level increase per minute for resource production allows for more ME (Mass and Energy) in mid to late game
-Also, ACU gains abilities such as Bulletrain and Dance of Death to allow it to defend itself in a squeeze situation.
-Who doesn't love something that can be kept and used efficiently throughout the entire game? Start weak, get strong, attack. Then, in the end, if you do die, you die because you were outmatched, not because you staged and planned your Illuminati-type JFK assassination. And when you die, you go out with a bang, blowin' shit up like a boss. It's satisfying.
CONS
-While it is extremely fun in those special times (late game ACU vs. ACU, those are always awesome) it does become extremely OP in the late game.
-Resource production may become Paragon-like and you won't have to worry about ever stressing your ME. In the late game (after 45 minutes or so) when your ACU is in the level 60's, experimentals start building in 30 seconds and such and ACUs become T4-counter-batteries. It seems that this is when you have to do all or nothing T4 fleets (unit cap, if applicable) to finish your opponent. It is quite extreme with blackops experimentals though.
-Bulletrain (and dance of death and such) may be extremely overpowered. If you're doing a 3603 (3612 now, I'm behind the times) quick battle, then tvg will make it easy for you to run from and derp the tier 1 attack force.
-Single player leveling faster than multiplayer leveling. In multi-player, you'll get lucky to be at level 10 after thirty minutes. A way to get around this is all start off allied against some super AI then betray eachother after the AI dies. Then you have quick leveling and fleets of units.

I guess what I'm saying is, that bases become stronger and fleets become easier to build, generally contributing to extreme games. Tvg+blackops is my favorite combination for long extreme games, and having fleets fight is eye-candy of a sort. Of course, you can always enable and disable mods, so turn it on when you want to play it, and turn it off when you're feeling the level-lag.

So, any posts, anyone want to discuss the strategy or meaning? I do enjoy normal battles here and there, easier on the time, but harder on the micromanagement. Also, let me say, if you do something wrong for a minute on TVG, it's intensified. Your opponent's ACU might be twice as powerful as yours with more upgrades and heavier weapons. Then you have to do like me against multiple AI and fight like a renegade master

Hope I'm slightly more than useless

[GuardPatroller]

Because TLDR and many are trolls, here's shortened version.

Tvg might be op but it speeds up the game and allows larger fleets for more extreme battles by implementing a never-ending veterancy system. Good.

[Myrdral]

GuardPatroller if the mod is not being played on FAF already then it is largely up to you to help it gain popularity. Hopefully, someone can help you get it to work on FAF if it does not already. Count me as a potential warm body in games with that mod if you get it working

[eXcalibur]

hey, this sounds like a very interesting mod. i would certainly try it, if it is a featured mod in FAF. but to become this it needs to be a .scd file (i think) and it needs a few adjustments to FAF.
(just read viewforum.php?f=32 . these guys also try to get another mod working in FAF as a featured mod)
if this is the case contact Ze_pilot and he will implement it as a featured mod in FAF. but it seems to be a lot of work to transform a mod into a .scd file (see the link above). i do not know how to code, but i would be willing to test it.

how do you play TVG? with the vanilla FA (3599) or with the latest single player verison of FAF (3615)? Does it even work with 3615?

[GuardPatroller]

Alright, I'll definitely talk about it more.

And I've been busy so I hadn't gotten to try it out with the most recent patch. But there's no reason it shouldn't work for this one. And it's downloadale, I always put files directly in the mod directory, which should simply be found in C:/Users/(name)/My documents/ My games/Gas Powered Games/SC:FA/mods. If that folder doesn't exist one would simply create it and put mods (in this case, the folder named TVg_v4.86 with the hook folder, textures folder, mod_units, mod_info, v001, jump costs and readme files) into the mod folder. I'll hope ze_Pilot reads this, but I should finish my book before I game again... Close though.

[GuardPatroller]

Here's some extra info in case you didn't click on the link (mod would be downloadable if you click on the Total VeterancyG v4.86 at the top of the post).


Mechanics:
Killing a enemy unit gains you enemyLevel*xpValue.
You need 4 times your own value to progress a level +10% for each gained level.
A units XP value is sqrt(masscost + energycost/10 + buildtime/25) with exception of ACUs and SCUs who have a lower value.
Shields gain XP while they are damaged at 150% a level per minute.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Multiplayer
Economy, Intel, Shields, Storages gain a third of a level per minute while enabled.
Builders gain xp on cempleting to build depending on costs.
Silos gain half a level when building per minute, They need to be active for more than 2 ticks.
Shields don't recharge to full on levelup.
Teleport Time decreases much slower, caps at a few seconds.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Singleplayer & MP Survival
Economy, Intel, Shields, Storages gain three quarters a level per minute while enabled.
Builders gain 2 levels, Silos half a level while building per minute.
Builders gain xp on completing to build depending on costs.
They need to be active for more than 2 ticks.
Shields recharge on Levelup.
AI Unit levels can be adjusted via UI buttons.
(Land,Defense,Structures,Navy,Air)
BuildXP can be enabled/disabled globally via button.
Teleport Time decreases faster and caps at up to 1 second

I suspect that Multiplayer is already quite balanced, maybe level up like the current veterancy, but giving a small boost when a structure is completed. It also provides veterancy after five levels but your ACU must really be in combat or something for that to happen. So how about it, is this mod worthy for FAF?

[eXcalibur]

i found a serious bug in this mod. i think it makes it unplayable:

the commander ranks up when it builds, upgrades and when it fights and kills enemy units. this is intended and ok.
but after you have fully upgraded you acu, you can still upgrade it even more (you loose other upgrades when you do this). you still rank up for that.

i just upgraded it (with a lot of engineering stations) about 50 times. this way i have easily managed to get an acu with more than 1,500,000 hp (rank >200). it could easily beat every experimental. but i have hardly fought any enemies.

[GuardPatroller]

I've only played with 3599 version, maybe it's different on 3615? But that does sound about right.

But yeah, it's not necessarily a bug, the ACU upgrades when it does stuff (on single player and campaign, and it is OP) but if you do battles like that against a normal opponent, maybe they'll have a similar strength ACU? I and a friend loved to do that (a long time ago), by fighting against 4 or so AI, then right before we finish the last one off, betray our alliance and fight eachother with our super ACUs.

It's much less in multiplayer, you get XP when you finish building, and when you kill stuff. It's still pretty cool, but not really as epic in those one or two great matches that you get with the one friend. It adds variety, certainly, but when you want a normal, balanced match, just do a normal multiplayer battle (test if you can find anyone? This comp doesn't run FA ) and it'll play normally with its great veterancy system.

[eXcalibur]

i have edited my post to make it more clear what i mean.

yes the commander is over powered. this is ok.
yes the commander ranks up by building something and/or fighting.
yes the commander ranks up by upgrading itself. because it builds an upgrade for itself.

but the commander ranks also up, when you upgrade the same upgrade the second (and the 25.) time. that is the problem.

[GuardPatroller]

Right. Well I'll say that's just a flaw in the mod itself and may apparently not be fixable... It's very iffy to play. I remember days on GPGnet when it was hated by just about everyone for its broke-ness although in the few matches I did get to play I never encountered someone who used that exploit to get a (more) ridiculous ACU... Well then, I guess if you play with someone else, don't tell them about it? It is a shame that it can't be fixed, however. The mod is pretty old, this version (4.86) came out sometime in 2009, I believe, so I'm convinced Ghaleon and whoever else won't be updating it. I do hope I helped, sorry for the derp.