Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

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Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Exotic_Retard » 04 Nov 2016, 18:33

settle down, this is gonna be a huge wall of text.
here i will be offering an overview of 3 candidate for the position of player councillor, and i hope you find my comments interesting, entertaining, and maybe even useful.

but before we begin, lets just get some things out of the way.

as incredible as it sounds, i am trying to be as unBiassed (ha-ha) as possible here. yes, we all know i support tokyto in this election, but i have reasons for it, and honestly that's not relevant here. It might be interesting to know that at one point i considered switching all my support to giebmasse and even ask tokyto to abandon the race so we can ensure giebs victory more easily. surprise? :D well thats just how we work around here i guess.

anyway, lets begin. our candidates that i will be looking at:

[e]Tokyto
[JEW]Giebmasse
[BAW?]Biass



these guys share a bunch of stuff in common, and actually, either one of them would make for a nice PC. really. however, since we are a pedantic bunch, we obviously are seeking the best and maybe this is what we will find.

first lets start with Tokyto:
Spoiler: show
sigh. yes he is in empire clan, yes im supporting him, but that doesn't mean he gets away unscathed.

lets go through his promises point by point and judge all of them:
so in general he goes through the pledge and says how he will adress each responsibility. nothing special there.
1) Organizing event schedule
here he says he is td and knows whats up. he has hosted like 50 different tournaments, so i guess i believe him there.
better system for advertising tournaments inside the client.

uh oh. promises of changes to the client? well we know how thats gonna end. not tricking me bro. seriously though, if you promise to get something improved like that, you better have a plan to do it. more on that later (all the candidates make tons of bs promises like that, you will see plenty)
Clan League.

ok this i know about. its gonna be run similarly to the empire ladder week, and we already know how thats gonna go down. perfectly feasible. sucessful? maybe. it depends on what prizes we will be able to through about and spefic details. but yeah, my approval of this one.

2) Organizing tournament directors
relatively straightforward part, just making people listen to you, no problem there, being pc does actually have benefits you know.
that with a more integration (Tournament Tab)
oh dear. another promise needing client code. yeah good luck with that, im sure i saw an issue on that somewhere.... oh yeah i remember actually working on this with someone, until that project died over a year ago. i still have the leftovers in my github. so thats got a bright future doesn't it? at least Tokyto goes on to mention that its a futile endeavor.

everything else he says is perfectly feasible. in fact he is somewhat playing that role already, him and fred are hosting a ton of tourneys between each other. really the only hiccup in this section is that tourney tab promise.

3) Gather feedback from the community about top desires and problems +
5) Organize player surveys

interesting. he lists these 2 together. it makes sense i guess. lets see what he has to say about it.

every 3 months there will be a large survey about server stability, in-game balance and possibly more. Also more irregular, smaller surveys that would focus on specific issues.

yep, super easy, i could make one right now on whats new if i wanted to. no problem with that at all. only thing is that its totally obvious that this is a thing, not really going beyond my expectations here.

4) Stay in touch with the community as much as possible on general issues
again, totally obvious and expected stuff here, no surprises. yes, he is active, yes, he is in touch, whatever i guess. xD


and now onto the slightly more interesting stuff where we see what he does that's above his responsibilities.

A) Development (patches, connection issues, bugs reporting, Downlords client, new features)

One of the most important feature I would like to implement would be reversing old patches.

ok so this isnt client code necessarily but 2 things need to be mentioned. 1. you are not the game councillor boy, not even the balance councillor 2. we actually have this kinda in place already, but devs are a bit cranky on this imo, so its not working that well. but yeah, nice try at impressing us <3

support mods and maps

i like this. i really do. in fact this is one of those things that's feasible and fits role of PC and actually helps. in short - hes promising to shout at IceDreamer to stop being a d*** and disregard mod support like he currently does, the response being "if they want it to work in their mod they can write the code"
perfect promise, if only his others were like that.
highest priority for FAF should always be connection.

hahahahahaha
Image
no respect here. this is like a money grab attempt where he says oh yeah i will make cereal rain from the sky and fix your connection issues. do you know how to code? well if so theres an ICE-adapter in works atm (which, WHO would have thought is top priority) that will fix a bunch of issues. might as well not list this here.

Ingame bugs should be caught by balance team and beta-patch testing. But if they are not, they should be easy to report.

yeah no. same as above. but not actually that bad. here he can use is magical PC powers to ask people to test more, but i dunno if that would last for more than a couple of weeks. (based on past experience, 3 weeks later only one guy left) however, having said that even that is of benefit, so actually this is not solvable, but you can help it with pretty minimal effort.

Also I’m aware of most of the ingame bugs myself, since I play a lot of FA.

bonus points for being in the e clan abuse hunting team i guess xD
but yeah, certainly true. if he reports bugs that would be great.
promote Downlords client more

yeah sure why not. no real opinion here or comment either way. downlords client is being developed, official faf one is pretty dead. not that much more to say here.

Regarding new features, I think the old ones need to be fixed first. Lot of people want Galactic War back, but i’m pretty sceptical about it for now. First we need fixed Map Vault, Mod Vault and then there should be time to make GW again and empty promises aren’t going to bring it back either.

here we go. 1. thats ironic given he made a few
2. totally agree though, atm its actually had some work done on it but things like website come first, and other things are being prioritised over that.
3. theres kinda a strange thing here - people think you can just prioritize things like that. to some extent yes, but faf devs are people who do what they want. if i want to work on balance, i will, i dont even know how the client works, outside of themes. saying i have to work on client will not get me to do so.

however its not totally futile, if you poke people enough we do get things done.


B) Balance

Balance of FA itself is not the agenda of Player Councilor, yet gathering feedback about it is.

same as my point about surveys. ABSURDLY easy. im kinda interested why balance cancerlor hasnt had enough time to make any yet.

Also there has been a movement for Blackheart to be a balance councilor and part of listening to community is also doing something about it. Things should move forward here and a poll about balance needs to be done as soon as possible.

ahahahaha i guess toky just secured my vote
but seriously, i have a lot of things to say on this topic, but not here xD

C) New Players, Vacant Councilors

New players in FAF need a better approach. Tutorial Tab links needs to be fixed as a start and hopefully we will find enough development time to integrate some ‘new players’ tutorial feature.

hope all you want. heres some 2 year old issues that no one ever bothered to look at:
being sexy may not be enough to convince them:
https://github.com/FAForever/client/issues/18
https://github.com/FAForever/client/issues/19
https://github.com/FAForever/client/issues/20
/55 "Nice Try"

Filling Promotion councilor, Mod & Map Councilor, Game Councilor positions should start right after Player Councilor vote, although not the agenda of Player Councilor, so all i could do is encourage Visionik to try and fill them faster.

again, totally obvious, but its nice to know that he cares. its kinda silly we wait 24 months for things to happen like that.

Lastly I would like to talk about my achievements and actions in FAF.

hit top achievement is being master of rating decay. goddamn.



of course, there are other things to look at as well:
1. he is in empire clan. now, seriously, before everyone and their dog goes "but e power trip" i think its worth mentioning that the reason we have so much power is that we earned it, by contributing. xD if anything Tokyto is super experienced already at being PC because hes already done a shitton of PC things. and hes in a place where he has competent advisors on tap all the time. i dont know if the same can be said for the other candidates.
2. pretty nice and funny guy, not a retard (ha-ha) kinda approachable i guess. nice qualities for PC to have.
3. has free time to do this stuff, and had it for ages so i think he will have it in the future to come. this is very important. so he doesnt suddenly have 25 hour work days.


TLDR:
vote tokyto xD
he makes a couple of standart empty promises, but overall i think hes a solid choice because i have seen him contribute in the past and it should be obvious he is capable.
also he works with a team, and that concept is normal to him, so he should be able to easily organize an army of contributors to get things rolling.



if you thought that was harsh, lets see me get to the others, i will write the next candidates out when i have time. prepare yourselves : D
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Mad`Mozart » 04 Nov 2016, 19:32

Sorry havent read the wall of text yet but i hate how there are khm-khm certain people shamelessly endorsing their khm-khm certain friend :?
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Aulex » 04 Nov 2016, 19:38

Mad`Mozart wrote:Sorry havent read the wall of text yet but i hate how there are khm-khm certain people shamelessly endorsing their khm-khm certain friend :?

Nothing wrong with that, very normal for anything that involves voting
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Exotic_Retard » 04 Nov 2016, 20:17

ok so lets move onto giebmasse,

please dont be upset, its all in good intentions (ha-ha)!

Spoiler: show
Briefly about myself:


Before I joined FAF, I was running servers and a gaming community for another game, ArmA 2:OA and the DayZ mod for it.

I managed the servers, databases, forums, website, administration, development and so forth for about three years. Servers had on average around same amount of monthly unique players as FAF currently has, give or take 1000 players.

Ever since I've been an active player at FAF, I've noticed similarities between the communities, both from a player’s perspective and from a management/developer point of view. I can relate to both parties and see things from different perspectives, which perfectly fits in the role as a player councilor whose task would be to be the link between the players and the Council of Setons.

ok damn. actual qualifications here. this alone is a pretty good reason to vote, i think you could have just put that and called it a day.

lets see where we go from here.

I would be there for you
Represent the interest of the players for the council, via:
Find and gather other contributing individuals

yeah, whatever, bscly whats outlined in the pledge. its nice to know you would be there for me gieb-baby <3

Condense information that is flowing around FAF

ok this is obvious as well, but what comes next is amusing:

Goal is to have one "news dashboard" that has all the essential news and hot topics about what is going on in the community.

did someone say client and new feature?
you know how i said in my tokyto review that there are gonna be plenty of bs promises like that? well you better hold onto your hats then. with both hands.

ok now its necessary to break way from the format of doing this point by point. lets see which of his promises involve some coding requirements?
Goal is to have one "news dashboard" that has all the essential news and hot topics about what is going on in the community.
Moderator tags for moderators, I can't even begin to count how many users think OPped bots are moderators
Autojoining #noobs/#beginners channel for players with x amount of games or less
(Show a popup message containing this link on the first login (maybe also later) or integrate that into the client itself)
Link FAF account with forum account,
Bring forums up more in the client
A proper "Get Started"-page for new players
Remove/replace/update unused tabs (eg. Tutorials)
User report, bug report, forums etc.
Easy bug report function
Easily visible patch status for players, eg. if beta patch is crashing, unplayable, stable or only minor bugs

the ones in bold are things i imagine to be especially fun. notice how almost everything is in bold?

but ok lets look at a list of things ive personally seen discussed, which died on the wayor for one reason or another are not done:
Goal is to have one "news dashboard" that has all the essential news and hot topics about what is going on in the community.
Autojoining #noobs/#beginners channel for players with x amount of games or less
(Show a popup message containing this link on the first login (maybe also later) or integrate that into the client itself)
Link FAF account with forum account,
Bring forums up more in the client
A proper "Get Started"-page for new players
Remove/replace/update unused tabs (eg. Tutorials)
User report, bug report, forums etc.
Easy bug report function
Easily visible patch status for players, eg. if beta patch is crashing, unplayable, stable or only minor bugs

well then.
and no this isnt just me being a d***. every single one of these ive seen some kind of startup which died. the moderator tags i havent seen being mentioned ever. sounds like an ok idea i guess. a bunch of these ive seen discussed before but they never got off the ground. as mentioned in my tokyto review, the tournament one ive worked on, but that got totally abandoned. i still have the code even.


(disclaimer: this does actually depend a LOT on the quality of implementation. i see a bunch of ways that would cut down the effort needed by about 10 times. however, they are not perfect and would require more maintenance, as well as being rather ghetto. also knowing how faf devs prefer an engineered implementation, you would need to deal with convincing them too.)


Image

now lets be a bit more specific.

link faf with forum accounts? .... yyyyyeah thats gonna be easy, at least the client ones are straightforward but lack volunteers. this is gonna be a tough cookie. how do you suppose we do that? im almost certain that since this is related quite a lot to faf databases this is sheeo/downlord area here. i hope you're feeling lucky there boyyy.


so lets say you are a councilor and you want to fix "Autojoining #noobs/#beginners channel for players with x amount of games or less"

well, im pretty sure that voodoo is a moderator councilor and that currently a lot of irc related things arent really working and him being a councilor didn't really make it happen, and he asked a bunch of times as well.
what are you going to do differently?


ok so at this point its worth mentioning this:
but I've been lurking around and would like to start coding again...

thats the ONE thing that makes me not just start to kinda disregard you at this point. you made a whole bunch of old ideas and if you didnt know how to code it would have been like "well why dont you ask them nicely then xD"
if you do this yourself, well we might actually get somewhere. this adds a ton of value to gieb. however, not necessarily as a candidate for PC
how much free time do you have? if you are a coder then it will take time and it will take time away from your official duties as PC. theres no 2 ways about it. while the things you listed are certainly nice, if you expect them to be done by someone else i dont see that they will all be done. it will take at least 2 years.

maybe 2 or if we are super lucky 3 of those points will be done, and thats if you have someone helping.
certainly dont expect everyone to come dancing along to your tune just because you got the PC hat.
which brings me back to this thought - having coding knowledge and spending time coding takes your time away from your pc duties. if you want these promises to be fulfilled i expect your time to be cut into, and possible compromise your PC duties. unless you are ithilis-style maniac who finds time from nowhere. prove me wrong. i will be happy.

because you will need either a lot of minions or time or both to do the other things listed:
Document undocumented things

riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight
well, having written the faf wiki with speed, i think its quite a bit of work. feel free to attempt it, after all any 5 lines added is already an improvement so cant go wrong here,
but to do this comprehensively? doubt it. seriously doubt it. how many edits do you think it needs? well speed has like 1000 and i have 650 if that says anything, wiki is still quite empty.

Plug the gap between players <-> github <-> developers

same as above; you can make progress here with minimal effort but its unsolveable. again cant go wrong here but this is mostly an empty promise.

If game breaking bugs occur a rollback should be made ASAP unless a hotfix gets done quickly

same point as tokys - welcome to faf my dear.
we could fix this by either having proper testing, or by .... doing what we already do? for 3660 i think there were like 2 hotfixes rolled out unless im wrong.

interestingly its in the worst shit-times that the most progress seems to be made. not saying we should, just an observation xD

Feedback for solved reports to users

100% approve. feasible. helps. fits role of PC. perfect suggestion. same as toky though - if only the rest were like that <3


A big part of the proposed changes and upcoming tasks are not something one man can undertake, but as the player councilor I’d work together with other councilors, developers and contributors to bring them to completion.


just before the end but one of the way more important points here. its absolutely essential not to be a one man band, and recognition of this fact makes me happy that your iq is at least over 30 (you beat mine!)


TLDR:
Spoiler: show
only read the start and the end of his manifesto (that alone is enough for a solid cancerlor); the rest is either achievable empty promises, or stuff that's bscly obvious that everyone promises to do like listening to players.

honestly gieb would be better suited to being an advisor or vice-PC than pc, since that liberates him to fulfill his (unrealistically) grand plans, while the PC can deal with the daily tasks and shit he has to slough through, like those 500pms a day he would undoubtedly be getting. no way of developing if you are constantly needing to deal with people like that. even if you do delegate everything.


i love you gieb <3
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Exotic_Retard » 04 Nov 2016, 20:18

Mad`Mozart wrote:Sorry havent read the wall of text yet but i hate how there are khm-khm certain people shamelessly endorsing their khm-khm certain friend :?


eeexactly! you read my mind!

but actually i kinda feel sad that you think im just doing it like this, i think i made a pretty level headed judgement about each candidate : (
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Ithilis_Quo » 04 Nov 2016, 20:20

Mad`Mozart wrote:Sorry havent read the wall of text yet but i hate how there are khm-khm certain people shamelessly endorsing their khm-khm certain friend :?

When you will read that then will see that its not because hes freind. 80% of post is about criticize him.

_________________________
I will add my piece to discusion. Doesnt matther what quality tokyto have, and he have them a lot (extremly freindly, non conflict, active, more like to do staff as talk about it).

The best quality that he have is that he is part of Empire clan. Better say he is one of 4 people who establish Empire clan. This can hear extremly selfis, while im in same clan. But its not about i support someone because hes in my clan or because hes freind, its because i know how we work and how we help each others with tasks #slavery2016. What is much higer probability that they will be done. And hes singing on position where is already most active FAF member and know what is going on.
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Farmsletje » 04 Nov 2016, 20:59

f*** Tokyto
FtXCommando wrote:
need to give him some time to blossom into an aids flower
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Morax » 04 Nov 2016, 21:10

This was a nice write-up and all but I think the "empty promises" should factor in as they will continue to fight to make them not empty promises. Just because it's been futile in the past does not mean it always will be. We could by chance get more devs down the road so saying this doesn't sit well with me.

Tokyto_'s point about Blackheart being balance councilor is one reason I believe the PC position will not change much itself, but will influence the next decision as visionik said he will look there afterward. I'm a bit on the fritz about BH being balance councilor since he is one to avoid playing if he doesn't like something (e.g. for the past year-ish), and it has been stated that many people simply don't want to work with him - fair point as well. But, maybe BH's idea of a real balance team is the better focus.

Imo any of the 3 will be fine as biass has created maps for the ladder pool so it stops being boring (the Hollow map is like something I've never experienced before and <3 it), Tokyto_ is a great organizer and fun person, and Giebmasse just clearly has the top level of experience in post-mortem game community.

It's going to be pros and cons for each result, but I'm happy to see this all moving forward as Soon(tm) is and will be happening.
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Darth_Google » 04 Nov 2016, 22:03

I'd still rather support Biass
A useful guide for a newer players that i find a great success following to.

viewtopic.php?f=62&t=13336
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Re: Retards Retarded Review of Candidates for PC

Postby Gorton » 04 Nov 2016, 22:29

All the shameless promotion just made me want to vote gieb even more than I already did.


By the way I have edited out the purposeful misspellings of names.
Please stop doing that.
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