Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-26T08:35:13+02:00

BlackYps wrote:
If you want to encourage repairing buildings, why not simply reduce the repair cost?
Having damaged units behave worse in some way causes massive balance implications on all kinds of unit interactions. I don't think thats worth it.

Also having the speed/resource output/whatever start at arbitrary values and going down to an arbitrary percentage (which you would probably need to do to balance it) makes this feature a lot less elegant and intuitive.

The problem with reclaim, it gives 81%, no point repairing: ctrl-k + rebuilding is almost always better. Repair needs to be 100% for 19% of mass cost for it to be usefull.

Statistics: Posted by techmind_ — 26 Mar 2020, 08:35

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-26T01:01:05+02:00

If you want to encourage repairing buildings, why not simply reduce the repair cost?
Having damaged units behave worse in some way causes massive balance implications on all kinds of unit interactions. I don't think thats worth it.

Also having the speed/resource output/whatever start at arbitrary values and going down to an arbitrary percentage (which you would probably need to do to balance it) makes this feature a lot less elegant and intuitive.

Statistics: Posted by BlackYps — 26 Mar 2020, 01:01

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-25T23:33:35+02:00

what if it only effected units after specific % of damage, so it only starts slowing them down when they are on 10-20% hp or less instead straight from 100%, more weird to see a 1 hp unit go around happily like its on full hp

Statistics: Posted by Mach — 25 Mar 2020, 23:33

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-25T23:27:26+02:00

This would make t1 bombers way OP in ladder.

Statistics: Posted by LabPunk — 25 Mar 2020, 23:27

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-25T12:05:43+02:00

Damaged units acting exactly as not damaged units creates good tension in games. you are rewarded for keeping your units alive on low HP. you can use something to tank damage and then act at the last moment.
Also this change would nerf higher tech units. When you fight t2 vs t1, if t2 units win it may be that whole army will be on half of HP. If t1 units win it may be that half of them are dead, that is pretty big reason why t2 t3 units are good. Removing this advantage from them is questinable and would require alot of other balance changes.

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 25 Mar 2020, 12:05

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-25T08:02:10+02:00

Mach wrote:
and have units move slower with slower rate of fire the more damaged they are

This would make auroras and other kiters insanely broken.

Statistics: Posted by RedX — 25 Mar 2020, 08:02

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-24T18:08:15+02:00

FtXCommando wrote:
Sounds like a buff to drops and t2 bombers when they don’t need one. Also sounds like a pointless increase on micro that doesn’t increase the skill cap at all.

The danger of keeping a pgen on 5% hp is that it can blow up everything around it pretty quickly (and t3 pgens tend to be around important things).

I agree it would buff drops, but I think it's very rare for people to repair anything, even pgens, except while the initial attack is ongoing (if they think they can keep it from dying). If not it just gets a reclaim order to prevent the explosion. If you have a decent amount of power you are probably better off building a replacement pgen, and then reclaiming the 5% health one rather than repairing it.

And then there is still zero reason to ever repair a mex because they don't explode. I actually intentionally avoid ever repairing a mex, because it's a total waste of mass! If it dies later you usually just get the reclaim from it and rebuild it for a small loss, but less than if you had repaired it earlier.

It's not like this game mechanic is super broken, but it's just a little weird that there is very rarely any reason to repair buildings. On the other hand it's somewhat consistent with reality that sometimes its not worth it to try fixing something old and broken, and to just recycle it and build something new. So I dunno. It's not a big deal either way, but it still would seem workable (and potentially better) to have buildings operate at less than 100% based on damage (at whatever rate seems best, maybe we decide they always produce at minimum 75% efficiency, after testing).

To be clear I'm stopping short of saying we should apply something similar to units. I can imagine it, but it would very significantly change the game if you change unit dps, speed, etc. based on their hp remaining.

Statistics: Posted by Steel_Panther — 24 Mar 2020, 18:08

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T07:29:57+02:00

Sounds like a buff to drops and t2 bombers when they don’t need one. Also sounds like a pointless increase on micro that doesn’t increase the skill cap at all.

The danger of keeping a pgen on 5% hp is that it can blow up everything around it pretty quickly (and t3 pgens tend to be around important things).

Statistics: Posted by FtXCommando — 23 Mar 2020, 07:29

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T06:54:57+02:00

Mach wrote:
and have units move slower with slower rate of fire the more damaged they are

This is actually bad mechanic for mobile units, longer range is already an upside.
For units leave as is, only do this stuff for resource/buildpower buildings.

Statistics: Posted by techmind_ — 23 Mar 2020, 06:54

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T04:17:24+02:00

and have units move slower with slower rate of fire the more damaged they are

Statistics: Posted by Mach — 23 Mar 2020, 04:17

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T03:46:53+02:00

Rather add a slow burn mechanic on buildings under x% hp than some arbritrary value like this 4head

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 23 Mar 2020, 03:46

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T03:24:19+02:00

Just play Rimworld. Something something.

Statistics: Posted by Endranii — 23 Mar 2020, 03:24

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-23T03:03:01+02:00

keyser wrote:
would you make the mexxes produce less depending of the damage ?
would the facto/engie/ACU would be less rapidly when they are damaged ?
should a 95% damaged T3 pgen, produce only 5% of its full health output ?

Of course there's no reason to expect damaged things to work at full capacity. I guess no one is advocating that units with damage deal less damage or anything (which would also be logical but could get too complicated), but it seems reasonable that buildings work less effectively. It doesn't have to be exactly equal to the amount of damage though. E.g. just make it a 0.5% reduction in efficiency per 1% damage, so a 50% health building works at 75% capacity, and a 1% health building at 50.5% capacity. Because I agree that right now there is very rarely any reason to bother repairing buildings.

Statistics: Posted by Steel_Panther — 23 Mar 2020, 03:03

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-22T18:43:16+02:00

keyser wrote:
would you make the mexxes produce less depending of the damage ?
would the facto/engie/ACU would be less rapidly when they are damaged ?
should a 95% damaged T3 pgen, produce only 5% of its full health output ?

It's probably enough to trial this with pgens only at first. T1 pgrns won't be repaired but t2 and t3 maybe. The death weapon adds reason to help repair itm

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 22 Mar 2020, 18:43

Re: Damaged pgens should produce less power

2020-03-22T07:34:04+02:00

keyser wrote:
would you make the mexxes produce less depending of the damage ?
would the facto/engie/ACU would be less rapidly when they are damaged ?
should a 95% damaged T3 pgen, produce only 5% of its full health output ?

Probably they should, repairing buildings = spending mass. There is no downside to have damaged building cause reclaiming a wreck kinda returns 80% of the mass, so repairing is always is a waste of mass. The only buildings which get repaired are smd's & shields.

Statistics: Posted by techmind_ — 22 Mar 2020, 07:34