Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-15T21:19:04+02:00

I like how this would make the Aeon Beacon even more useless.

Statistics: Posted by LabPunk — 15 Sep 2019, 21:19

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-13T15:10:44+02:00

When was the last time something was done to Frigates, in a patch? Seems to me they've been missed!

Statistics: Posted by snuffles — 13 Sep 2019, 15:10

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-12T22:33:40+02:00

Except people still spam t1 arty at all stages of the game pretty much and t1 can still be useful in the form of labs or someting.

Statistics: Posted by Dro — 12 Sep 2019, 22:33

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-12T20:39:16+02:00

Blodir wrote:
Frigs are my favorite unit in terms of balance. They are useful throughout the game without making other units useless at all. I wish I could say the same for land and air balance.

This makes sense. I dont have a big problem with t1 units still having a place later in the game, but it is just a bit counter-intuitive. We are all used to just building only the higher tier units at every other stage, so navy is just opposite. We'll laugh at the noob who keeps spamming mantis after they hit t2 or t3 land. But I cant think of a good way to make lower tier units still viable for land, or air. Except where t1 arty and bombers can still be useful.

Statistics: Posted by Steel_Panther — 12 Sep 2019, 20:39

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T18:40:20+02:00

30 mantis will kill a percival, but it doesn't mean mantis need to be reworked, nor does a percival. I know this analogy does not work very well because percivals can have titans to deal with t1, but I think it is an important comparison. If one player makes 200 frigates and 3-4 battleships, and the other makes 6-8 battleships, but only 60 frigates, then it makes sense for the overwhelming number of frigates to win, thats like 50k mass in frigates.

Statistics: Posted by UnorthodoxBox — 10 Sep 2019, 18:40

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T18:30:32+02:00

so in setons there is just masive frigate spam throught whole game? hm... looks like I played different setons

Statistics: Posted by ZeRen — 10 Sep 2019, 18:30

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T18:24:34+02:00

The higher tier units are stronger, just not in hp for mass. I don't see the fun in spamming 100% Battleships. The frigates can stay relevant for the entire game while the other ships are still quite valuable.
To me it just seems like you are salty because you lost to frigates. Why do you refuse to build frigates late game? You already discovered that this is the solution to not lose to your enemy's strategy.

By the way, the Cruiser having missiles is also "counterintuitive" like in fact all the stat details on all units. At some point everybody has to have a closer look at the stats, if they want to play on a high level.

Statistics: Posted by BlackYps — 10 Sep 2019, 18:24

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T18:21:02+02:00

Bennis- wrote:
Blodir I disagree: I think the risk of teching higher tier (Power and BP investment mostly) should be rewarded with a unit that is stronger over lower tech in terms of mass efficiency. Its a straightforward principle that you find in all areas of faf: pgens, tanks, planes, all. Just with frigates counterintuitively you dont have it and unaware players are tricked by that and lose to frigates (me).

I think thats counterintuitive and therefore should be fixed, much as the reclaiming mex thing is counterintuitive and should probs be fixed so peope spend less time zoomed in their base and more time microing their units.

change my mind.

well then i'm waiting on you farming rating by doing 100% frig spam (and the odd torp to kill subs)

Statistics: Posted by keyser — 10 Sep 2019, 18:21

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T18:13:27+02:00

Blodir I disagree: I think the risk of teching higher tier (Power and BP investment mostly) should be rewarded with a unit that is stronger over lower tech in terms of mass efficiency. Its a straightforward principle that you find in all areas of faf: pgens, tanks, planes, all. Just with frigates counterintuitively you dont have it and unaware players are tricked by that and lose to frigates (me).

I think thats counterintuitive and therefore should be fixed, much as the reclaiming mex thing is counterintuitive and should probs be fixed so peope spend less time zoomed in their base and more time microing their units.

change my mind.

Statistics: Posted by Bennis- — 10 Sep 2019, 18:13

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-10T13:55:58+02:00

Frigs are my favorite unit in terms of balance. They are useful throughout the game without making other units useless at all. I wish I could say the same for land and air balance.

Statistics: Posted by Blodir — 10 Sep 2019, 13:55

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-09T10:51:44+02:00

Little Miss Murder wrote:
Battleships could also do with smaller ancillary weaponry to help deal with spam

If battleships had a secondary weapon with a little more range than a frigate, but a lot less range than a destroyer, that would help to keep frigates under control. But maybe "frigates swarming a battleship" should be a legitimate strategy, because we want people to have to screen battleships with destroyers and frigates. We don't want a pure battleship navy strategy.

If destroyers were given a close-range weapon like that, for example the equivalent of having the guns of 2 frigates in addition to their main guns, that would make frigates less effective against destroyers. But there would still be an incentive to keep frigates around, and with enough frigates you could still swarm destroyers.

I don't see a reason why a pure destroyer force should be a bad thing. If someone wants to make 6 destroyers and move them as a pack, without frigate support, that should be a legitimate way to fight frigates. They are meant to destroy such things.

Statistics: Posted by armacham01 — 09 Sep 2019, 10:51

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-09T09:42:02+02:00

T3 ships and the Tempest should have the crush ability against T1 ships.

Battleships could also do with smaller ancillary weaponry to help deal with spam, something akin to the fattie's riot guns.

Statistics: Posted by Little Miss Murder — 09 Sep 2019, 09:42

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-08T13:17:00+02:00

Frigates are good as they are currently?

ofc. some minor fine tuning between the factions could still be done, but in general terms frigates are ok IMO

Statistics: Posted by Viba — 08 Sep 2019, 13:17

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-08T04:33:45+02:00

Hover land units will obliterate frigates on smaller water maps like White fire, Open waters, Eye of the storm and land maps with water like Island zero, Tag craftious maximus. Not even speaking about High noon, Wilderness, Paradise, Four corners ect.

UEF frigates with 1060 HP (50% less) and 50 DPS for 280 mass aren't exactly a good counter to Blazes with 1100 HP and 50 DPS for 220 mass that can also get some shields. Even if Frigates would draw t2 hover tanks - they still can't follow them on land.

Doing this change will just result into Aeon/Sera winning those maps as a rule.

If frigate spam is a problem may be should do something about T1 subs being completely useless? EQ doubled DPS of t1 subs and that unit became especially good against ships without good torp defence. This way you'd just stop frigate spam with t1 subs and force enemy to focus on destroyers and t2 subs - pretty much your goal is achieved without fcking up balance on *other maps that aren't setons.

Make t1 sub great again!

Statistics: Posted by Apofenas — 08 Sep 2019, 04:33

Re: Proposed Frigate Rework

2019-09-08T01:24:33+02:00

Yea, I agree with this. I play a lot of Setons Beach and Rock. I always end up spamming Frigates early game at my rating and winning, because people tend to rush t2 destoryer but i just spam frigate and win tbh. Which shouldnt happen if im being honest. T2 and T3 should be on the battlefield late game not a 100 frigates. Frigates are so tanky and soak up so much damage. Like you'll be 30 minutes in spamming frigates still with destoryers and battleships in support xD

Statistics: Posted by Azraeel — 08 Sep 2019, 01:24