Forged Alliance Forever

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T19:57:02+02:00

D4E_Omit wrote:
I'm pretty sure in photoshop if you change the image size it's just stretch it or make it smaller without changing any colors/greyscale. It's under Image > image size I think

That is what I am saying...

It would be good to know how to change the color range proportionately to the image size, if you know what I mean. Not that I assume PS can do that automatically... but I'd like to know how to achieve that effect.

You can also compensate for the deformation effect in teh map editor by adjusting the height to hue mapping... but there needs to be some formula... proportionate changing of values wasn't it iirc. There was something very iffy about it, when I tried it.

Statistics: Posted by Lionhardt — 10 Dec 2014, 19:57

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T19:21:24+02:00

D4E_Omit wrote:
I'm pretty sure in photoshop if you change the image size it's just stretch it or make it smaller without changing any colors/greyscale. It's under Image > image size I think

Yes, but there are also stratum textures, props, markers and decals. This can take some time to also change

Statistics: Posted by ozonex — 10 Dec 2014, 19:21

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T18:30:02+02:00

I'm pretty sure in photoshop if you change the image size it's just stretch it or make it smaller without changing any colors/greyscale. It's under Image > image size I think

Statistics: Posted by D4E_Omit — 10 Dec 2014, 18:30

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T18:23:58+02:00

Oh, and scaling existing maps is a major pain in the butt btw... because you throw off the ratio of (width/height)/grayscale values, if you don't alter the hue values.

I am sure there exists some clever solution to this problem, but I never figured it out. If you do so in the process of scaling Debris please tell me the trick! It always rove me insane when I tried to do it.

This would be a very handy tool to have btw. A map scaling tool that keeps the maps 3d-proportions intact.

Statistics: Posted by Lionhardt — 10 Dec 2014, 18:23

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T17:51:28+02:00

I agree with what Lionhardt said, a 40x40 map won't be played very much. However I don't really see Debris working as a 20x20 map either. The sheer amount of islands will make it quite difficult to maneuver ships and I expect hoverspam will be quite dominant. Go ahead and do it though, it'd be really interesting to see at least

Statistics: Posted by Blodir — 10 Dec 2014, 17:51

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T17:35:54+02:00

ZLO_RD wrote:
People do not even like point of reach or Roanoke
And you want to add 20 km map with ton of small islands...

I thought people did?.. Go on then ZLO, tell us what maps people like please. Because I am wrong.

DISCLAIMER:
That is not supposed to sound patronising even though it sort of does

Statistics: Posted by Kalvirox — 10 Dec 2014, 17:35

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T16:39:56+02:00

Then go ahead do it. I predict nobody is gonna give a... care, because 40km. The game just doesn't perform on big maps. Pathfinding gets screwed somehow. Orders just don't register etc.

Statistics: Posted by Lionhardt — 10 Dec 2014, 16:39

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T15:58:19+02:00

Well that's why I think 40x40km is a sweet spot for Debris. It would bring an element of long distance and sparse economy in a similar vein to, say, Emerald Crater. 40x40km opens up some interesting dynamics which, I believe would make it worthy of competitive attention. Without being the current, 81x81km , insane, turtle/tele map which it currently is. As a case in point, I would draw your attention to Point of Reach. Which is a very dynamic map on the 1v1 ladder.

20x20km would simply make it a clone of Roanoke. Albeit with smaller islands. At 20x20km the maps would become overly dominated by T2 navy. Whereas a 40x40km map would require a longer T1 phase and dispersed playstyle. Make it smaller if you want. I just think it would work better at the larger size.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 10 Dec 2014, 15:58

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T14:46:17+02:00

People do not even like point of reach or Roanoke
And you want to add 20 km map with ton of small islands...

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 10 Dec 2014, 14:46

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T14:07:30+02:00

Lionhardt wrote:
Making 40km maps is a waste of time, unfortunately. Nobody plays those maps. That's why I stopped working on my 40km maps as well.

Which was why I initially suggested 20km

Statistics: Posted by Kalvirox — 10 Dec 2014, 14:07

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-10T06:14:21+02:00

Making 40km maps is a waste of time, unfortunately. Nobody plays those maps. That's why I stopped working on my 40km maps as well.

Statistics: Posted by Lionhardt — 10 Dec 2014, 06:14

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-09T22:50:57+02:00

Hawkei wrote:
Though one thing you should note about Debris, which is an 81x81km map, is that it has a particularly low mass to surface area ratio. Consider for instance that one single island on Debris only has about 3 mexes. Now also consider that these islands are surrounded by an expanse of water equivalent to the detection range of an Omni sensor (that is the entire playable area of Setons Clutch).

This means that there will not be very much income and players are forced to defend large areas with small groups of units. It is precisely this style of play which makes Debris so unique. The logistical requirements of moving and supporting forces over such long distances is truly where Supreme Commander comes into it's own as an RTS game. It is a pity that more players don't enjoy playing on 81x81km maps.

I would perhaps be interested to see Debris remodelled as a 40x40km map. But reducing it to 20x20km would, I believe, defeat the fundamental intent of it's design.

Make it and I will love you forever, if the amount of land/water ratio becomes a pain just change it so there is more land.

Statistics: Posted by Kalvirox — 09 Dec 2014, 22:50

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-09T21:13:06+02:00

Though one thing you should note about Debris, which is an 81x81km map, is that it has a particularly low mass to surface area ratio. Consider for instance that one single island on Debris only has about 3 mexes. Now also consider that these islands are surrounded by an expanse of water equivalent to the detection range of an Omni sensor (that is the entire playable area of Setons Clutch).

This means that there will not be very much income and players are forced to defend large areas with small groups of units. It is precisely this style of play which makes Debris so unique. The logistical requirements of moving and supporting forces over such long distances is truly where Supreme Commander comes into it's own as an RTS game. It is a pity that more players don't enjoy playing on 81x81km maps.

I would perhaps be interested to see Debris remodelled as a 40x40km map. But reducing it to 20x20km would, I believe, defeat the fundamental intent of it's design.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 09 Dec 2014, 21:13

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-09T16:40:47+02:00

Personally, I am a big fan of maps like Syrtis, Regor, Standing Stones, Palms, Vya ect. I think it would be nice to have some, and I hesitate to use the term, "crossbreeds". Now, before you say that's not a good idea I agree but we need some similar styles. The reason Syrtis works nicely as a map is because it's based on rate of expansion to the adjacent corner whilst denying your opponents side and then collecting lots of reclaim from lots of rocks. Same with Regor, Your adjacent expansion is in the middle of an adjacent side of the map but is still far away and, due to interesting reclaim placement and cliffs, makes for a very diverse and action packed piece of game play.

This is the sort of "theme" that I feel works well and that we should have more maps like this in the map pool.
Of course others don't necessarily feel the same.

If we look at navy maps now.

Roanoke, Sera Glaciers are the two better navy maps in the map pool and if it was not 81x81km I would put debris there (20x20 debris remake? Maybe cut out the inner rings of islands and shrink it down to size, I would play that). These maps are determined by how fast you get air up, expand, how soon you start your navy. These are what I would call "skill maps" where there is a lot going on at once and there are lots more factors to consider at once than in a map like Regor. I may not be very good at these maps but I enjoy playing them because of the factors previously stated.

Bermuda Locket is a mixture of the two and we need more maps like it in the map pool. Not only is it about expanding fast to make sure your sides don't get rolled by using a transport where the is a tonne of risk of it being shot down but also getting navy up fast and ecowhoring to the max. This map involves land, sea and air with quick expansion being a necessity and lots of different tactics that could be employed whilst still having diverse game play.

These are just my idea's based on the current maps in the map pool. I will endevour to get some paint sketches and things attached to this thread and see what you make of them.

Thanks for taking the time to actually take a look at this thread and I am happy to see so many people up for it . I will personally test every map you make related to this thread to give you feedback.

Statistics: Posted by Kalvirox — 09 Dec 2014, 16:40

Re: More 1v1 maps for ladder

2014-12-09T16:42:04+02:00

Sure, that can happen. But anyone with a radar or scout will see that easily. You should give them an incentive to move there other than a potential attack route.

Anyway, I was talking more about the edges or corners of maps. Places where there are no attack routes but there is no reason to move to.

Edit: what I mean is, a small amount of empty land is kind of incorporated automatically. You can't put mexes on every square meter or even reclaim. You will have natural empty spaces, no artificial long expanses of nothing.

Statistics: Posted by SneakySnake — 09 Dec 2014, 16:39