sasin wrote:
Maybe it would be a good idea to have the wrecks be darker if they have more mass in them, or something like that? Some sort of nice, visual, subtle, elegant way to let players have an idea how much mass is in a wreck.

rockoe10 wrote:
^^ This. I find it difficult at times to memorize every rock and wreck on a map. I also like to try new maps and don't have the time to memorize all the reclaim values on a particular map. Having the TOTAL mass when the game starts is what I was getting after. Having the current mass remaining is not so important for me. I can find that out by reclaiming it. But I am one of many people who don't have every rock value memorized.

errorblankfield wrote:
^
Static mass -sure no problem. This literally changes nothing because we know that value already as 90% the cost of the time. The worst, this removes the need to memorize the approximate cost of literally every unit in the game.
I'm sure a handful of people oppose that notion, but I for one think that's a minor lose that doesn't negatively affect the game.

Now vision giving exact mass is more of a problem (and again, one I can likely accept but don't feel like imposing on everyone else for legacy reasons mainly). While it may intuitively fit that if you see a wreck you can say 'oh, there is only 50% there, it was 1000 mass before so 500 now', that's new info we can't get now -without carting an engineer to the locale.

Minor difference, but the engy needs two things that vision doesn't. One, an escort (in most cases). And two, to travel on foot. The later I feel has notable impact on the game. A scout can see anything with relative ease. If a fatty wreck is sitting behind your base, I can see it even if you try really hard to stop me. But there is no chance I'm carting an engy to it -reasonably.

I can see updating with the correct value once an engy gets on the wreck as they display the little progress bar that you could then mentally find the exact amount in your head from. (Again, it's cutting out a bit of skill but much less so that the vision = exact method.)

Hope this clears up my viewpoint.
-Cheers

errorblankfield wrote:
Disagree with you there lionhardt, changing the game is an argument against it. And before I explain why, let me reiterate that I like the idea but realize it's a change and therefore shouldn't be forced merely cause I (and others) like it.

Anyway, having this intel for free (not rolling an engy up to the wreck) obviously yields a minor advantage for everyone. If we had a situation with a wreck equally spaced between two opposing teams, then this is fair. Both teams get the same info and have an equal chance to act on that information. I'd even extend this rationale for moderately 'middle-ish' for wrecks that aren't clearly under one sides territory.

But as soon as a wreck falls under someones apparent control, this mod isn't fair anymore and impacts the game due to this imbalance. You now have more information when the wreck isn't yours to control than you did before. While you aren't going to get the mass yourself, you can watch your opponent drain it as they please. Maybe they are going to suck it down ASAP or they are going to slowly sap away from it.
Sure scouting gives a decent idea of how quickly it's being sucked up but that's intel you can deny if you so choose. (Radar is counted by just keeping engies there not reclaiming, planes with AA, generally pausing and taking mass as needed is hard enough to keep track of.)

To give a hard number removes a lot of meta. You don't have to worry what's happened to the wreck if you can't see it -get vision and then you know how much mass was taken while you didn't have it -or-it's gone to 100% has been used (duh).
You don't have to roll an engy to a wreck to see if it's worth anything anymore. That time cost is a real part of the game, we can't just cut it out cause it's convenient.

Yea, it's a lot of stupid almost tedious upkeep with wrecks that only really matter for the experimentals, but they define the game we know and love.

If this is done, it has to be implemented globally for balance and at the same time, it shouldn't be because it dumbs down a lot of game play. Smoother and arguably more intuitive, but dumber and more streamlined regardless. (Moreover, for those of us that don't want it clogging up UI, it needs be optional -yet balance implications force people to use it against their will as well.)

And at the end of the day, that's a direction I don't want the game to go in. Love the idea, but we shouldn't do it. :S

Lionhardt wrote:
I think it's interesting for contested exp wrecks. Your opponent has already sucked on that wreck for a while and you have no idea how much mass is left thus no idea wheter it's still worth fighting for.