Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-25T03:13:57+02:00

Empty you can easily sandbox one or twos game to unrust and refresh your memory. Takes a grand total of 30 minutes to do this. I don't buy your excuse at all.

There is the problem where you are better at different game types. People get to this stage not because they want to farm rating but sometimes they just like a game type more. It can suck when your 1700 rating in setons is actually worth 2500 in team games. Without making multiple accounts the only way to solve this issue is to add a setons 4v4 rating apart from 1v1/team game ratings. Not sure if it would clutter up the UI too much for OCD people though.

Statistics: Posted by epic-bennis — 25 Dec 2018, 03:13

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T19:07:14+02:00

I missed the point of the thread topic because I intentionally joined to participate in the smurf derailment. :bigbrain:

Rating Decay is pretty delicate. I mean once you factor in 2018 rating inflation, not playing is basically a decay already! Basically, it’s a good idea but I don’t know what parameters should be used for it nor whether the time it would take to code is worth the value gained.

Statistics: Posted by FtXCommando — 23 Dec 2018, 19:07

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T19:01:18+02:00

You totally missed the point FtX.
If I want to branch out I will do it ez on my main account as I did already by playing other maps and getting more rating. Frankly it was nice change of pace making Heaven and some SNF noobs cry and wail about how I have no idea what the game is about cuz' I focused on Objectives instead of eco and so called meta.

The point is to actually come back to game after not playing it for long periods of time without having to spend 20-30 hours on pure game ruining, which have nothing to do with branching out.

Fun fact I got already accused for rating manipulation after coming back from first hiatus but hey who cares.

Statistics: Posted by Endranii — 23 Dec 2018, 19:01

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T18:43:50+02:00

only solution is ladder rating reset every ladder season and rating decay for global/teamgame rating.
smurf even not used in a bad way shouldn't be needed. We all know there is plenty of flaws in the current rating. (especially the global/teamgame rating)

Statistics: Posted by keyser — 23 Dec 2018, 18:43

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T18:35:26+02:00

Smurfing is not a solution to a dysfunctional rating system where you can freely choose a map and basically only “play well” at a certain spot on a certain map. You made the error of deciding to get a 2000 rating on one map and now that you want to branch out you’re going to have to deal with the fact you aren’t able to play at that level.

Smurfing had absoutely zero use and Blodir we all know you only have that account so you don’t need to worry about losing rating on your first account. Frankly if I was a mod I’d be considering it rating manipulation.

Statistics: Posted by FtXCommando — 23 Dec 2018, 18:35

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T18:34:39+02:00

PhilipJFry wrote:
only one way to find out

if you feel like someone is not telling the truth about his sisters acc feel free to make a report
I'm the last one when it comes to letting ppl have multiple accs (if i had my way i'd have banned obfuscation a long time ago for example)

No i won't, cause as i said multiple times before i have no problems with that.

speed2 wrote:
Please don't assume what mod team knows about. If there's a problem, use the report form. The same way you won't get an ingame issue fixed if you just rank about it in aeolus, you actually have to report it.

Please don't assume that the mod team is oblivious of anything, especially when they just said that they knew about blodirs and heavens second account. Also you think that it's better to report a double standard by mods to mods instead of openly discussing it in public? I don't think so.

speed2 wrote:
And asking why you wouldn't get the same treatment if you decided to ask for a new account is just ridiculous. That just feels like you wan't to start a fight over a situation that didn't happen, just for a sake of arguing.

No it is not. After all endranii is not allowed to make a smurf even though he is not gonna use it for 'smurfing activities' but as a way to get a more accurate rating, but at the same time heavens new account was tolerated. Yes, endranii didn't really say it in a good way, but you can't deny that there is a double standard.

speed2 wrote:
And sure, your new acc might be from your sister, but it's not so hard to figure out it's you playing...

Apparently it is

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 23 Dec 2018, 18:34

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T17:51:36+02:00

PhilipJFry wrote:
Please read the rules

Should we find a smurf that we can link to you then we will permaban said smurf and also apply a temp ban on your main

Last time I talked with mods in aeolus it was said that smurfs are okay if not used to bully random people, which would have no consequences as I would play with exactly same people as before, just would make them insta lose by being overrated.

Geosearchef wrote:
Displayed rating = 3 sigma percentile = mean - 3*deviation
(meaning you are 99.73 % likely to play at least as good as the displayed rating)

My idea was to actually adjust the deviation with time, which would lead to actually getting lower rating displayed. For now I guess I will just take a look at true skill 2 implementation and see if something like decay is actually implemented in it.

biass wrote:
Endranii wrote:like say 300/400 points maximum after not playing for 3 months.

I like the idea of decay but that's a little too extreme, i would dumpster a 1000 no matter what, and i haven't played in almost a year now.

Yeah the numbers are up to fine tuning like always, I just dropped this number as a 1500 seton whore would easy dumpster me just by executing stolen BO and me not remembering my own ones.

Louvegarde wrote:
If you have something to report, please use the report form.
"but someone else did smurfing and got away with it!!!" is not an excuse to allow smurfing, especially if you didn't report it otherwise.

So if it's not reported then it's no problem then. Lookin' good. Especially that all mods know the smurfs that are being used often by a well known players.But I guess no report no consequences even if mod teams knows about rule breaking.

PhilipJFry wrote:
about the entire thing - the rating system is set up to compensate inaccuracies fairly well and fairly fast
if you lose games that the system predicts you to win then the amount of rating you lose is proportionately higher
so i recommend you just play for a bit and your rating will adjust within less than 10 games (which is faster than making a new acc and getting where you "should be" again while not having to stomp some poor noobs along the way)

Come join me in my endavour to get proper rating, will be fun when you tryhard your shit like always while I just try figuring out how to rush asf in your team. Or what was the reclaim pattern for trees. Or what were the proper compositions of units against certain faction compositions etc. I can already see your passive agressive question about why am I doing such things.

PhilipJFry wrote:
if you feel like someone is not telling the truth about his sisters acc feel free to make a report
I'm the last one when it comes to letting ppl have multiple accs (if i had my way i'd have banned obfuscation a long time ago for example)

So you know but won't act cuz' no report.

speed2 wrote:
Second accounts are tolerated as long as they are not used for abuse. If the ratings are similar, we don't ban them. I don't like it, I would prefer just a single account per player, some other mods share the opinion, so think it's fine as long as those accounts are not abused.

So currect status is, they are tolerated.

Please don't assume what mod team knows about. If there's a problem, use the report form. The same way you won't get an ingame issue fixed if you just rank about it in aeolus, you actually have to report it.

Well that's the idea of smurf? To get back to game without ruining peoples games by being overrated by over 300-400 points.
If I wanted to stomp noobs I can do it by playing Lol with my OTP champ, and it would be way better experience than playing with noobs in FAF.

As for second part it's kinda stupid again, if mod is actually speaking with smurf using his main account name then yeah kinda hard to believe they don't know he is smurfing.

Blodir wrote:
I don't understand what's the big deal? It took me literally 5 games to reach 1800+ rating... if someone is eg losing on purpose to stay low rating on their smurf then the problem is rating manipulation not smurfing.

Why shouldn't someone want to have 2 different accounts..? Like for example imagine you are a 1800 gapper dude. You know know that you are overrated af if you joined holy senton so you don't want to ruin it by joining... here's a solution! Make a new acc to play sentons on. Everyone's happy

Well that's exactly what already happened, one guy made a smurf to play setons and climbed by learning with new account so he can play the big boi one. Everyone is fine with it.

Second case a guy wanted to play with us being 2200 rated, didn't get a single chance to do it. Ended up with really bad after taste as we simply had to threat him like the lowest of lows as he was literally 1000 rated on setons, kicking from lobbies each time he tried to play. Can he play other seton games? No he was kicked from other ones too cuz much 2.2k. THe guy didn't even get to play on his seton level cuz he was treated as 2.2k by random low level players while the good players treated him like the 1000 rated he is. Poor soul ended up having to play all welcome hosted by himself untill he dropped to 1.4k. Trully inspiring.

Statistics: Posted by Endranii — 23 Dec 2018, 17:51

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T16:05:42+02:00

And again I have to bring up this issue. The moderation team is there to moderate, to make sure everyone is friendly, nobody breaks the rules and everybody has fun. It IS NOT THERE to make decisions on those rules when they affect areas outside their responsibility.

Disallowing smurfs is not a moderation related subject, it's a decision that was taken by the (representatives of) the community. Therefore it's not the moderation team's job to decide whether or not to enforce those rules. You cannot just make an exception for a single person if the rules don't specify those. (and please don't start to edit the rules now) @Moderation team: Please stop making such decisions.

Was this account created to create a lower rating or to allow him to remain anonymous?

Statistics: Posted by Geosearchef — 23 Dec 2018, 16:05

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T16:02:26+02:00

I don't understand what's the big deal? It took me literally 5 games to reach 1800+ rating... if someone is eg losing on purpose to stay low rating on their smurf then the problem is rating manipulation not smurfing.

Why shouldn't someone want to have 2 different accounts..? Like for example imagine you are a 1800 gapper dude. You know know that you are overrated af if you joined holy senton so you don't want to ruin it by joining... here's a solution! Make a new acc to play sentons on. Everyone's happy

Or how about if you got shiny 2000 rating from being an absolute gapper god. But you aren't happy! Teams are always too stacked against you and you just wanna chill and build massfabs. But behold! There's a FFA tourny coming up! You join it and get -400 rating for your efforts. Is this rating manipulation? Would it have been more morally correct to play on a smurf acc to avoid the absolutely broken FFA rating to twist your gap crush rating?

Smurfs are only bad if they are bad

Completely derailed topic, but nothing's gonna happen in terms of rating decay so whatever.

Statistics: Posted by Blodir — 23 Dec 2018, 16:02

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T15:39:43+02:00

Second accounts are tolated as long as they are not used for abuse. If the ratings are similar, we don't ban them. I don't like it, I would prefer just a single account per player, some other mods share the opinion, so think it's fine as long as those accounts are not abused.

So currect status is, they are tolerated.

Please don't assume what mod team knows about. If there's a problem, use the report form. The same way you won't get an ingame issue fixed if you just rank about it in aeolus, you actually have to report it.

And asking why you wouldn't get the same treatment if you decided to ask for a new account is just ridiculous. That just feels like you wan't to start a fight over a situation that didn't happen, just for a sake of arguing.

And sure, your new acc might be from your sister, but it's not so hard to figure out it's you playing...

Statistics: Posted by speed2 — 23 Dec 2018, 15:39

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T15:35:45+02:00

only one way to find out

if you feel like someone is not telling the truth about his sisters acc feel free to make a report
I'm the last one when it comes to letting ppl have multiple accs (if i had my way i'd have banned obfuscation a long time ago for example)

Statistics: Posted by PhilipJFry — 23 Dec 2018, 15:35

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T15:24:14+02:00

Louvegarde wrote:
If you have something to report, please use the report form.
"but someone else did smurfing and got away with it!!!" is not an excuse to allow smurfing, especially if you didn't report it otherwise.

You're missing the point entirely. I don't want to report anyone cause idc if anyone has a smurf. What i care about is that different people get a different treatment. There's a decent amount of high rated players that have second accounts / smurfs which is known by everyone, but no one cares if they have it. But why are they allowed to have it while others can't.

Also stop the "you didn't report it" excuse all the time when we both perfectly know that the moderators are aware of these players.

PhilipJFry wrote:
heaven contacted us and asked us if we are ok with him doing so before creating a new acc

the moderation team agreed on letting him have his new acc so he can have a lower game count (which was something i didn't agree with personally but that's just how it is)

someone just announcing that they will break a rule is not a justification for doing so and the same goes for claiming that someone else did the same thing

So if for example i'd want a new account because i don't want other people to know i played 3k games on this one what would happen? Would i get the same treatment as heaven and could i just make a new one? And if not, why wouldn't i get the same treatment?

Or maybe i could argue that the new account is from my sister? That seems to work pretty well too.

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 23 Dec 2018, 15:24

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T10:32:06+02:00

heaven contacted us and asked us if we are ok with him doing so before creating a new acc

the moderation team agreed on letting him have his new acc so he can have a lower game count (which was something i didn't agree with personally but that's just how it is)

someone just announcing that they will break a rule is not a justification for doing so and the same goes for claiming that someone else did the same thing

about the entire thing - the rating system is set up to compensate inaccuracies fairly well and fairly fast
if you lose games that the system predicts you to win then the amount of rating you lose is proportionately higher
so i recommend you just play for a bit and your rating will adjust within less than 10 games (which is faster than making a new acc and getting where you "should be" again while not having to stomp some poor noobs along the way)

Statistics: Posted by PhilipJFry — 23 Dec 2018, 10:32

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T10:21:52+02:00

Farmsletje wrote:
PhilipJFry wrote:Please read the rules

Should we find a smurf that we can link to you then we will permaban said smurf and also apply a temp ban on your main

And when heaven created a new account because he didn't like the 5k games behind his name it was okay?

If you have something to report, please use the report form.
"but someone else did smurfing and got away with it!!!" is not an excuse to allow smurfing, especially if you didn't report it otherwise.

Statistics: Posted by Louvegarde — 23 Dec 2018, 10:21

Re: Rating Decay

2018-12-23T07:13:12+02:00

Endranii wrote:
like say 300/400 points maximum after not playing for 3 months.

I like the idea of decay but that's a little too extreme, i would dumpster a 1000 no matter what, and i haven't played in almost a year now.

Statistics: Posted by biass — 23 Dec 2018, 07:13