Forged Alliance Forever

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-16T18:38:16+02:00

Honestly, engies are fairly expensive (40 mass I believe compared to 50 for a t1 tank), and you get what you pay for (don't forget the 250 mass for the pd -- so mass for mass, 4 engies + 4 t1 pd = 1160 mass, or, (divide by 50 mass per tank) ~ 23 tanks).

If you don't like it, bring arty or drop a single bomb on them. But there is no questioning that mass for mass, 4 engies building 4 t1 pd should be able to kill 20 tanks.

Statistics: Posted by codepants — 16 Jun 2016, 18:38

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-12T07:37:57+02:00

Y-y-y-ou like the uef bomber?

play sera for that amazing bomber-ino

(or aeon if you like .2 seconds of stun)

Statistics: Posted by biass — 12 Jun 2016, 07:37

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-12T04:02:58+02:00

briang wrote:
Seems like a ridiculous thread to have been made by an 1800+ ladder player.

Just goes to show. Rank doesn't mean everything.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 12 Jun 2016, 04:02

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-12T03:57:21+02:00

Seems like a ridiculous thread to have been made by an 1800+ ladder player.

Statistics: Posted by briang — 12 Jun 2016, 03:57

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-12T04:00:14+02:00

I may not have the best wording but...

A T1 bomber kills T1 engineers in one shot if it's a hit, and if it's not, then that means they are busy dodging the bombs (means you're wasting the opponent's precious time).

That is true, lextoc. That's why I prefer UEF bombers for dat AOE... to kill clusters of engies... aw, so meaty...

this whole thing happens near enemy base so you have to bomb enemy bp preemptively (maybe 30 s before you tanks roll in) which is not necessarily totally clustered. (for that you ofc need air control or a sloppy opponent)

No, you do not need good air control to send a lone bomber in. 1 UEF bomber over 5-10 clustered engies that are assisting a mex/building = all dead, including the bomber . I do these lone runs to suppress enemy radar so one does know when I am coming.

also this group of units could be a run by making a preemptive bombing/whatever not realistic.

Oh really? Then why do I bomb before a major attack?

Statistics: Posted by Lieutenant Lich — 12 Jun 2016, 03:46

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-12T01:00:13+02:00

only solution that i see is to mix arty inside of t2 facs so you have no chance of forgetting it

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 12 Jun 2016, 01:00

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T23:42:11+02:00

im not sure if youre talking about the same situation I am.

I either see the (5+) engies relaiming on enemy teretory or assisting something in the enemies base.
your group of units attacks (if it isnt a huge army ->20+ t1 units or sth equivalent in t2) there wont be too much t1 arty in it maybe 2-4 units (more doesnt do too well vs a more tanks less arty army) they wil get delayed for some time by a trown up pd (or 2 or 3).

like a Lobo drop.

this only works if 1st you know you will need the lobos (~1 min before your units will meet then engies, since you need to prepare the drop etc.) so they will be there in time. 2nd the drop doesnt get intercepted .

A T1 bomber kills T1 engineers in one shot if it's a hit, and if it's not, then that means they are busy dodging the bombs (means you're wasting the opponent's precious time). Please ask for advice before suggesting changes to the build power system. Aeolus is a perfect place to ask!

this whole thing happens near enemy base so you have to bomb enemy bp preemptively (maybe 30 s before you tnaks roll in) which is not neccecarily totally clustered.
(for that you ofc need aircontroll or a sloppy opponent)

also this group of units could be a run by making a preemptive bombing/whatever not realistic.

My whole point is NOT that you cant kill the pds. my point is it will take (a lot of) time the enemy can use to react,getting a bigger army there killing you army and reclaim...
also a prevented attack (maybe 4 defended mexes in an expansion) can easily be worth building 1-3 pds.

Statistics: Posted by Turinturambar — 11 Jun 2016, 23:42

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T23:32:18+02:00

Yeah t1 engies are great, the best unit in the game really(sounds weird, I know) but like lextoc said those defenses cost mass and if your opp has to build some random pds in normally useless spots then that's fine for you. And ofc, bring arties. Sounds like your problem is with t1 pds more than engies tbh.

Statistics: Posted by JaggedAppliance — 11 Jun 2016, 23:32

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T23:13:36+02:00

I have to agree with the OP to some degree. There is a rather significant discrepancy in the build power between factories and engineers. It's always amused me that an engineer can express almost as much (and sometimes far more) resources during a build than a dedicated factory. And this despite the factory having many times the build power of the engineer. This just feels wrong -- and IMHO contributes to the engineer spam effect. Obviously, the build time of engineer-built structures and factory-built units has never been normalized to address that.

Statistics: Posted by Sprouto — 11 Jun 2016, 23:13

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T22:14:43+02:00

A T1 bomber kills T1 engineers in one shot if it's a hit, and if it's not, then that means they are busy dodging the bombs (means you're wasting the opponent's precious time). Please ask for advice before suggesting changes to the build power system. Aeolus is a perfect place to ask!

And don't forget: everything your opponent builds costs mass and power, you can try to use that to your advantage.

Statistics: Posted by lextoc — 11 Jun 2016, 22:14

Re: engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T10:57:22+02:00

Nope, just L2P.

You need to bring the right tools for the job. Bring something which can kill the engineers and PD. Something with splash damage, like a Lobo drop.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 11 Jun 2016, 10:57

engineer defense forces

2016-06-11T10:50:46+02:00

I think its kinda sad that 5+ engineers can be as strong as 20+ t1 tanks/some t2 tanks. so you can just have some engies reclaiming/assisting and when some enmy units come your engies throw up 1-5 t1 pds and are able to either win or delay the enemies approach long enough that your army can smash them (the odd 1-3 t1 arties in the enemy army just can't kill the pdspam fast enough in many cases :/ ), also a new t3 mex with 20+ engies around it can hold of some quite strong amount of t2 or even some t3.
Also breaking through the enemie lines and attacking an heavily assisted HQ/factory/mex/whatever isnt worth it.
This can make attacking quite frustrating and lead to somewhat static gameplay (ofc a matter of preference).
I think it would be nice if heavy assist (5+ engies or whatsoever) on (t1 pds or rather defense structures in general) e.g.:
1 engie 5bp; 2gies 9,5 bp; 3 engies 13 bp; 4 engies 16 bp; 5 engies 18,5 bp; 6 engies 20,5 bp; 7 engies 22 bp etc.
with like a minimun bp for a lot of engies (so if you got 50+ engies adding 1 engie to the project would mean +1,5 pb or sth)
this would also give a possiblity for some more faction diversity like UEF having a cap at 3-2,5 bp and cybran one of 1,5-1 bp.(and sparkies suffering no penlties whatsoever)
same ofc for all

Statistics: Posted by Turinturambar — 11 Jun 2016, 10:50