Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-17T05:10:42+02:00

Works as advertised.

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 17 Aug 2012, 05:10

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-17T00:39:42+02:00

I added a lobby option that allows a game where the UI provides no information on how many phantoms are left, and does not announce a player's assignment when he dies. This is primarily for games with a long reveal time or no reveal.

Statistics: Posted by mead — 17 Aug 2012, 00:39

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-16T00:14:02+02:00

It's random. I've checked.

In case you're curious, the section of code that chooses the phantoms is:

Code:: for i=1,cur.stats.phantom_count do local ok = false local p = 0 repeat ok = true p = math.random(table.getn(cur.innocents)) for index, army in cur.phantoms do if cur.innocents[p] == army then ok = false end end until ok == true table.insert(cur.phantoms, cur.innocents[p])

Key in that being p = math.random(table.getn(cur.innocents)). In other words, pick some random innocent and make him phantom (unless he's already a phantom, in which case, pick me another random innocent).

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 16 Aug 2012, 00:14

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-15T23:16:54+02:00

Hey maybe this is slightly off topic but i didnt want to start a new one, recently ive played quite a few games on this mod and i get the feeling that every single time i play on this mod (with paladin) im a phantom. I think ive been inno only once so.. I dont know how you select players to be phantoms but it is clearly favouring me

Statistics: Posted by BenDover — 15 Aug 2012, 23:16

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-10T20:32:24+02:00

Here's the SCD version of the mod (complete with lobby options). This can't really be tested on FAF, because FAF will automatically overwrite the mod file with its version. However, it can be tested offline using AIs or IP based games.

If you come across any bugs, let me know.

After this is tested (by Mead, myself, and anyone else who'd like to test it), I'll request that Zep update the FAF Phantom-X mod with this version.

Instructions:
1. Download the zip file and extract it to a folder somewhere (doesn't really matter where).
2. (Optional) View the batch file and confirm that no one has put any malicious code in it.
3. Run the batch file.

The batch file will do the following:
1. Make a backup copy of your exisitng Phantom-X mod file (the on that FAF uses).
2. Copy the test version of the mod into your FAF gamedata.
3. Run FA with the necessary options to enable the Phantom-X SCD mod (game log will be written to the Desktop).
4. After the game window is closed, copy the original Phantom-X mod file back into the FAF folder.

Phantom-X v1.7 SCD Test.zip

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 10 Aug 2012, 20:32

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-06T04:21:59+02:00

My bad. I thought I set it the "Reveal To" option to Paladins only, but it was set to Phantoms and Paladins.

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 06 Aug 2012, 04:21

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-06T02:32:40+02:00

Just a little note: It reveals not only to paladin, but also to phantoms in 1.7c.

Statistics: Posted by mead — 06 Aug 2012, 02:32

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-06T04:21:11+02:00

Ok, here's the next update. On the outside, this one is basically the same as 1.7b. However, there are a lot of under the hood code changes (mainly coding for upcoming lobby options).

Phantom-X 1.7c
-The Phantom bonus percentages have been reverted back to their 1.6a values. (blame Mead for this one)
-Added "Reveal To" option. Available choices will be Everyone, Phantoms, Paladins, and Phantoms and Paladins.
-Added "Reveal Who" option. Available choices will be Phantoms, Paladins, and Phantoms and Paladins.
-Added a global bonus adjustment option. Available options will be 80%, 90%, 100%, 110%, and 120%. This will allow the host to tweak the phantom bonus amounts accross the board.
-Added Paladin Ratio option. Essentially, this option controls how many Paladins will be assigned.
-Added Paladin Bonus option. This will allow the host to set the Paladin bonus (as a percentage of the Phantom Bonus). Available choices are 25%, 35%, 45%, 55%, and 65%.

Since lobbly options don't work in regular mods, I've set the following options for 1.7c:
Reveal To: Paladins & Phantoms
Reveal Who: Phantoms
Global Bonus Adjustment: 100% (Normal)
Paladin Ratio: 3/5 (3/5th of a Paladin for every one Phantom, rounded down)
Paladin Bonus: 45%
Reveal Time 1: 20 minutes
Reveal Time 2: Same
Reveal Time 3: Same

As always, this is a test version. It's probably got a bug or two in it, so if you run into something, please let me know.

Phantom-X-Test-v1.7c.zip

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 06 Aug 2012, 00:10

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-04T14:07:18+02:00

I clobbered together a version that should incorporate the stuff we talked about:

CHANGELOG:
- phantoms are revealed to paladin only, timer is 30 minutes
- reduced number of paladins for 3 phantoms to 1; bonus itself has not been adjusted
- added UI bonus info back in; phantoms see bonus % and absolute mass / energy bonus; paladin only sees absolute values because bonus % could easily give away the phantoms prematurely
- Paladin designation is changed from "Paladin" to "Innocent (Paladin)", to avoid confusion for new players

IDEAS for future releases (some of these have already been mentioned):
- adjust paladin bonus % based on number of phantoms in game
- reveal phantoms to each other prior to being revealed to paladin
- when a paladin or phantom is killed, do not reveal if the player was phantom or innocent; do this only for normal innocent players

Statistics: Posted by mead — 04 Aug 2012, 14:07

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-04T00:16:55+02:00

MadDogTen wrote:
Though I still like my Idea of the Paladin's being able to see the current bonus Phantoms have.

Well, indirectly the paladin can tell. He sees his own bonus (at least he'll see in 1.7b), and knows that this bonus is 45% (1.7a) of the phantom's bonus - so the phantom bonus is roughly twice of what he gets himself.

Statistics: Posted by mead — 04 Aug 2012, 00:16

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-03T23:12:38+02:00

mead wrote:
Having played 1.7a quite a number of times in the last days, I find it to be reasonably balanced, including the paladin bonus of 45%. I have no further input regarding changes for 1.7b beyond those that have already been announced in this thread

MadDogTen wrote: What if killing the Paladin (No matter who kills him), slightly raises the Phantoms Bonus. Meaning that Phantoms would have a reason to not trust other phantoms and kill them, and have a reason to do it (Plus, if they do end up killing the person, they would always have the excuse that they thought it was a Phantom, and understandable so).
.
Considering the paladin's economy counts for the phantom bonus just like the other innos', killing him results in a considerable net decrease of the combined innocent income, and therefore a decrease in the total phantom bonus (around 25% if pala is the first person to die and there were 3 other innocents in the game, correspondingly more if there were fewer still alive). Offsetting this by increasing the phantom bonus percentage is very bad balancing-wise, because it penalizes the innocents all the more the weaker their team is, essentially guaranteeing a phantom win if the paladin dies. The only incentive phantoms need to kill the paladin is the fact that he is (or should be) the most dangerous innocent in the game.

Oh, ok. I didn't realize the Paladin Economy gave a Bonus to Phantoms, so I get what your saying, Though I guess it does make since that it does.

Though I still like my Idea of the Paladin's being able to see the current bonus Phantoms have. However to be honest I haven't tested the new version enough to know how the current Stats are for Phantom vs Innocent wins, so I guess this idea should be on the back burned until I play a bit more.

Statistics: Posted by MadDogTen — 03 Aug 2012, 23:12

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-08-03T15:29:18+02:00

Having played 1.7a quite a number of times in the last days, I find it to be reasonably balanced, including the paladin bonus of 45%. I have no further input regarding changes for 1.7b beyond those that have already been announced in this thread

MadDogTen wrote:
What if killing the Paladin (No matter who kills him), slightly raises the Phantoms Bonus. Meaning that Phantoms would have a reason to not trust other phantoms and kill them, and have a reason to do it (Plus, if they do end up killing the person, they would always have the excuse that they thought it was a Phantom, and understandable so).

.
Considering the paladin's economy counts for the phantom bonus just like the other innos', killing him results in a considerable net decrease of the combined innocent income, and therefore a decrease in the total phantom bonus (around 25% if pala is the first person to die and there were 3 other innocents in the game, correspondingly more if there were fewer still alive). Offsetting this by increasing the phantom bonus percentage is very bad balancing-wise, because it penalizes the innocents all the more the weaker their team is, essentially guaranteeing a phantom win if the paladin dies. The only incentive phantoms need to kill the paladin is the fact that he is (or should be) the most dangerous innocent in the game.

Statistics: Posted by mead — 03 Aug 2012, 15:29

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-07-31T20:58:57+02:00

These changes sound pretty cool. I always like new things that can shake up the game a bit more.

I have a couple of ideas, One is what if instead of raising the Paladin's Bonus all to high, they could see what the Phantoms Bonus is, hence, making it harder for Phantoms to tell who exactly the other Phantom is. Then while Innocents have issues knowing who the other innocent is, Phantoms would have the same Issue.

It would still be "easy" to figure it out (As, if the Paladin starts attacking a Phantom, then it gives him up. But if he sits and doesn't help Innocents, will cause him to lose in the end too).

and the other idea is (Which kinda goes along with the first idea), What if killing the Paladin (No matter who kills him), slightly raises the Phantoms Bonus. Meaning that Phantoms would have a reason to not trust other phantoms and kill them, and have a reason to do it (Plus, if they do end up killing the person, they would always have the excuse that they thought it was a Phantom, and understandable so).

Statistics: Posted by MadDogTen — 31 Jul 2012, 20:58

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-07-31T02:13:58+02:00

Great to hear all that. I'd keep the bonus at 45% for games with 2 phantoms though. Thats already enough to engage a phantom in a defensive 1v1, equal skill assumed.

Statistics: Posted by mead — 31 Jul 2012, 02:13

Re: Phantom-X v1.7

2012-07-31T01:13:43+02:00

From http://www.faforever.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=1501#p15662

Still, it might be good to add a "Reveal Phantoms To" option with choices such as "Phantoms Only", "Paladins Only", "Phantoms and Paladins", "Everyone", and "No one".

That's already on the list.

FYI Mead, With some effort, the Paladin can determine who the Phantoms are (using the same method I've told you about). The challenge for a Paladin would always be getting everyone else to go along with him. I definitely like the idea of revealing only to Paladins. As it is now, the reveal timer takes some of the challenge and suspense out of Phantom games. Basically, innocents just sit around and wait for either a Phantom rush or the reveal time to expire.

Anyway,

-I'll add the Phantom UI information back in. (I didn't really want to remove it to begin with, but this is a test version)

-I'll give the Paladin a UI as well so he can see the bonus he's getting.

-I'm not sure where I can put the remaining paladin count. There's not a whole lot of room left in that little box, but I'll see what I can do.

-In the final version, I'll probably make the number of Paladins configurable (and the bonus amount as well). For testing purposes, I'll go ahead and set it to one paladin and 55% bonus.

Statistics: Posted by Duck_42 — 31 Jul 2012, 01:13