Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-06-01T00:23:22+02:00

It can be countered, as long as you and your teammate focus your combined eco on an early rush.But it has to be performed efficiently enough to cause confusion and despair in the their eco effort. They will probably rage quit, but their strategy was already lame, so you can have hour conscience clean.

Statistics: Posted by prodromos — 01 Jun 2015, 00:23

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T23:09:20+02:00

If they have that much eco then it doesnt matter. And the idea is not to break them, the idea is to split their apm as much as possible. Secondly, you mentioned Sheild com as the opponent, and now you're saying RAS. If its a ras com then there are many easy ways to kill them, tele scus who teleport and spam t1 pd will get very far.

Honestly just play real games and focus on becoming a better player, you wont encounter bs like this AND you'll prolly have more fun from winning all the time!

Statistics: Posted by theeggroll — 07 May 2015, 23:09

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T22:58:49+02:00

theeggroll wrote:
thats when you spam things to put pressure on them. If it isnt a uef turtle, spam t3 mobile arty and mml's to put pressure. Doesnt require too much micro on your part, and they have to constantly think about fending off these units. RAS from two acu's is better than RAS from one acu, so thats another slight eco advantage of having two acu's vs one. In general I just recommend not playing turtly maps, and work on playing actual maps and getting better at other parts of the game. If you want a good eco whore experience with turtling and late game stuff, play some phantom. That has a role play element and it gives a good eco boost to make games pretty exciting. If this happens, then work on building things with your team mate, rather than you each building your own things. If you bring up typing as being difficult
"Hey, he is putting all his eco into one thing at a time, so lets work together to build things"
If your opponent doesnt help you with your things, go help him with his things. I personally consider myself a team player when im in a team game, so I try and help out my allies if I can, rather than just focusing on what I'm doing. (I played air the other day and was 2 minutes late on t3 because I saw my ally was getting beat on land so i made a few gunships) Type thing.

This I like. Just a few things:

1) both of their ACU's tend to have ras (for overflow)
2) They have so much Eco after the give that spam is usually ineffective.

You're right about phantom, its part of the reason why I've just started playing it more.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 07 May 2015, 22:58

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T22:18:42+02:00

thats when you spam things to put pressure on them. If it isnt a uef turtle, spam t3 mobile arty and mml's to put pressure. Doesnt require too much micro on your part, and they have to constantly think about fending off these units. RAS from two acu's is better than RAS from one acu, so thats another slight eco advantage of having two acu's vs one. In general I just recommend not playing turtly maps, and work on playing actual maps and getting better at other parts of the game. If you want a good eco whore experience with turtling and late game stuff, play some phantom. That has a role play element and it gives a good eco boost to make games pretty exciting. If this happens, then work on building things with your team mate, rather than you each building your own things. If you bring up typing as being difficult
"Hey, he is putting all his eco into one thing at a time, so lets work together to build things"
If your opponent doesnt help you with your things, go help him with his things. I personally consider myself a team player when im in a team game, so I try and help out my allies if I can, rather than just focusing on what I'm doing. (I played air the other day and was 2 minutes late on t3 because I saw my ally was getting beat on land so i made a few gunships) Type thing.

Statistics: Posted by theeggroll — 07 May 2015, 22:18

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T21:40:17+02:00

E8400-CV wrote:
acelenny wrote:
E8400-CV wrote:Yes, playing as a team in a team game is OP

ok, yes, its playing as a team, but it comes down to 1 person doing everything in the end and ruining the fun for other people.

Not really, the others just spend their time micro'ing the combat units they have or focus on getting reclaim. And you can have one person watch radar full time and ping if anything as needed. That's hardly one persone doing everything.

I've won 1 v 4 Setons in the past with worse eco, and I've also lost it 1 v 3 with better eco. Being on your own also means you can consume all your apm by fending off enemy attacks.

The point is that one person goes AFk while the other does all the microing and has all of the eco.

Also, this is not an issue on Setons where APM become really strained, this is only really an issue on maps like ISIS, waters of ISIS, Gap of Rohan and other maps like that. Ones which are fun and a bit turtly and tend to have fewer directions from which the enemy can come.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 07 May 2015, 21:40

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T20:17:24+02:00

acelenny wrote:
E8400-CV wrote:Yes, playing as a team in a team game is OP

ok, yes, its playing as a team, but it comes down to 1 person doing everything in the end and ruining the fun for other people.

Not really, the others just spend their time micro'ing the combat units they have or focus on getting reclaim. And you can have one person watch radar full time and ping if anything as needed. That's hardly one persone doing everything.

I've won 1 v 4 Setons in the past with worse eco, and I've also lost it 1 v 3 with better eco. Being on your own also means you can consume all your apm by fending off enemy attacks.

Statistics: Posted by E8400-CV — 07 May 2015, 20:17

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T18:22:00+02:00

E8400-CV wrote:
Yes, playing as a team in a team game is OP

ok, yes, its playing as a team, but it comes down to 1 person doing everything in the end and ruining the fun for other people.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 07 May 2015, 18:22

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T08:37:50+02:00

tatsu wrote:
it's a fucking exploit and needs to stop.

cheap-ass victory.

LOL team play is now exploit

More seriously, even on a turtle map, as long as you scouted a good part of the map, you can *easily* notice that a base, massive mexes, or massive pgens have been given.
It turns dimmed -> given

Now there are more sneaky ways :

- playerA stop building anything to auto overflow to playerB
- playerA manually boost playerB upon whats needed

Well no magic. Scout and it's *YOUR* task to notice that something funky is happening. And either you put pressure (as you should have more units, or else you had been overplayed already and you should lose), or you just do the same and try to beat them with your teamate.

You cannot seriously continue to complain this is unfair. It happens ALL the time. How do you think people build para/yolo so often ?

Statistics: Posted by -_V_- — 07 May 2015, 08:37

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T07:28:35+02:00

Yes, playing as a team in a team game is OP

Statistics: Posted by E8400-CV — 07 May 2015, 07:28

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-07T00:35:04+02:00

acelenny wrote:
Ok, so in a few of my recent team games, mainly on waters of Isis, I've been frustrated by how people who are working together will each build a base and then one will simply go AFk, giving their team mate complete control over everything. This gives that person a huge Eco on turtle maps and mulch-faction tech without them so much as having to rebuild.

One example (the replay for which I can't find) led to tempests, ASFs, nukes, T3 arty and finally a yolona oss being spammed and built and my team stood no chance. I just find this so frustrating and difficult to counter, especially in the person with all the eco has good APM.

Is there anyway to prevent this from happening? I'm guessing not because people should be allowed to give units and the share until death option has no impact because their entire team remains alive.

This happens to me ALL the time on isis.

it's a fucking exploit and needs to stop.

cheap-ass victory.

Statistics: Posted by tatsu — 07 May 2015, 00:35

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-06T19:59:08+02:00

I kind of like the first idea although it might be better for there to be a way for only some of what's given to be received, eg 50% of mass.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 06 May 2015, 19:59

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-06T18:29:31+02:00

It would be trivially easy to modify the "give unit" function to make it so that... I don't know.... there was a 5 minute delay, or it failed 25% of the time (causing the unit to explode rather than transfer) or some other limitation that prevented this.

Really though, I think it just goes to show the importance of good map design more than anything else. The advantage of having 2 players on a team versus 1 is simple: You start with 2 ACUs (extra combat unit/engineer + slightly more resources), and your attention/micro is basically doubled. As games get more drawn out, 1 combat unit/engineer and +1 mass make almost no difference, and the coordination benefit of having all resources controlled by one guy (instead of two) overcomes that.

If you wanted to solve this problem, you'd have to stick to maps that require more micro/attention. Waters of Isis is the opposite of that.

I think Seton's is a much better designed map because it is designed in such a way that one person can't usually handle all facets (left, right, middle AND air? Very very difficult to do)

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 06 May 2015, 18:29

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-06T11:10:21+02:00

I love team games, I just hate this kind of thing.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 06 May 2015, 11:10

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-06T10:56:40+02:00

Dude that's just team games lol.

You can play 1v1 if you prefer

Statistics: Posted by -_V_- — 06 May 2015, 10:56

Re: Base giving in team games.

2015-05-06T09:24:56+02:00

speed2 wrote:
Only problem I see in this is no teamwork on your side, work on that and you will have no problems dealing with this ^^ since your combined eco will be same and your opponent.

You are quite right, if all teams were on teamspeak/mumble it would be easy, however at my level (1100), it is very difficult to communicate effectively with the rest of my team using just in game chat.

Retnut wrote:
It is a lame tactic but it is also lame, from the other team's perspective, if their player ctrl-k's early... It should be pretty easy to snipe an AFK comm in late game, and if it's really not doable, I suggest the game was probably lost already.

Thats true, but this is only ever used on turtle/one direction maps and usually, their team just covers the AFK comm in personal shields and t3 shields to the point where a snip is almost impossible.

Statistics: Posted by Nemesis — 06 May 2015, 09:24