Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-21T11:24:00+02:00

Hmm you are right, i didnt think of depth thing, As for usefulness it would only be worth it during the first run where they are coming concentrated from one direction. And the Island/cruisers thing is just a given. Might still work in shallow water, would need testing.

Statistics: Posted by Deering — 21 Apr 2014, 11:24

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-21T11:00:27+02:00

There are a couple of problems with this. The torpedoes all go at the same depth because submarines all move at the same depth. Then there will be some collisions. If you attack the ground with submarines, the torpedoes will go downward immediately. This severely hampers the effectiveness of your improvised torpedo defence.

Secondly, it takes a lot of micro managament as soon as the torpedo bombers come for the second and consecutive passes. Then they'll be coming from all directions, at different times. You have to reassign the ground attack order constantly. I think it's better to move the subs to some place where they'll be covered by an island along one side and see if you can get cruisers or fighters nearby immediately. That'll not be so micro intensive and you're keeping your attention to the whole picture, rather than one group of subs. If fighter or cruiser protection is impossible (cruiser protection is almost never impossible), then you'll lose the subs anyway, so the micromanagement is fairly useless. You're better off doing something else.

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 21 Apr 2014, 11:00

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-21T10:30:48+02:00

And if you are getting attacked by torp bombers its definitely worth it to attack ground in the direction the torpedoes are coming from. There torps intercepting stopped a significant amount of damage.

Statistics: Posted by Deering — 21 Apr 2014, 10:30

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-21T00:48:47+02:00

Ahaa , so the Solace's Torpedo's are actually Depth charges too, like those from the T2 torp bomber.

Statistics: Posted by E8400-CV — 21 Apr 2014, 00:48

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-20T10:57:59+02:00

Here's some testing. Clearly, the subhunter dies in one go when there's nothing else around. When there are other subs nearby and the subhunters got in a fight, there is a problem. The torpedo bombers need three runs to deal with the subhunters. This is probably because of lots of accidental collisions, because I think that it's the subhunter torpedoes that stopped more depth charges than the torpedo defence.

Also, I think that no torpedo bomber has had interference from enemy torpedo defence. I can't remember T2 torp bombers having that issue, when they're alone, like the first Solace was in this replay.

So in conclusion: if you're going to get rid of enemy ships, it may be better to only send torpedo bombers, rather than torp bombers and submarines alike. Especially if the enemy ships are subhunters.

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 20 Apr 2014, 10:57

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-20T03:56:55+02:00

E8400-CV wrote:
Eh? I'm pretty sure it still doesn't kill in one pass.

Great. Why don't you spend two minutes testing this hypothesis and then report back with your findings?

Statistics: Posted by JeeVeS — 20 Apr 2014, 03:56

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-20T01:19:33+02:00

JeeVeS wrote:
One strange aspect of solace is that if given a specific attack order, it will often come around and drop an extra time on something that it has already killed, thus wasting a round of depth charges.

I think its a consequence of the unit 'hitbox' not disappearing as a target until it reached the bottom of the sea floor. I recall someone complaining about GC not being able to knockout engineers clustered around the navy, as it re-targeted only every few seconds, due to engineers slowly sinking to the bottom.

Statistics: Posted by Szakalot — 20 Apr 2014, 01:19

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-19T23:14:09+02:00

Eh? I'm pretty sure it still doesn't kill in one pass.

Statistics: Posted by E8400-CV — 19 Apr 2014, 23:14

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-19T11:03:23+02:00

E8400-CV wrote:
That last one is also why a T3 sub hunter from Sera doesn't die from one pass: it's health is now only 4000, but it kills off some of the torpedos before they hit. (right?)

Wrong, It does kill in one pass now. The solace's "torpedo cluster" is likely considered to be depth charges and doesn't trigger torpedo defenses. One strange aspect of solace is that if given a specific attack order, it will often come around and drop an extra time on something that it has already killed, thus wasting a round of depth charges.

Statistics: Posted by JeeVeS — 19 Apr 2014, 11:03

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-19T06:32:34+02:00

They are definitely not useless. W/o shield they one-pass kill any Cruiser. Although I have the idea that they get killed more easily than strat bombers.
Also: as opposed to strat bombers... they always hit, minus of course the minor interference of torpedo defences. That last one is also why a T3 sub hunter from Sera doesn't die from one pass: it's health is now only 4000, but it kills off some of the torpedos before they hit. (right?)

BRNKoINSANITY wrote:
The data base is wrong. It reads the initial blueprints, but the torp splits into two when it hits the water. The actual damage is exactly double what is listed in the database.

Ah. I asked about the same issue last week in Aelous; because the DB indeed lists 2000 damage while the 2400 hp Sera T2 Cruiser dies from one pass.

Statistics: Posted by E8400-CV — 19 Apr 2014, 06:32

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-18T13:38:51+02:00

When there are shields involved, you don't want to use any form of torpedo bomber. This because of two reasons:

1. Torpedo bombers have no area of effect weapons. So if you hit at the edge between two shields, only one will suffer from it. Strategic bombers are much better in this case.
2. When you bring down one shield in a group, the others can easily back it up until it regenerates. The best way to deal with this, is by having a rapid fire ability in your strike force (either by something with a continuous laser or a group of units that fire one after the other). Then you can take down several shields more easily, compared to having bombers make a pass, take out a lot of shields and then still having a shield block them when the return for the second pass (If you only take down shields at the front, the ones in the back are still annoying in the second pass). This holds true for any bomber attack though. Just think of the many failed assassinations because the enemy ACU was able to walk around in a heavily shielded base.

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 18 Apr 2014, 13:38

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-18T13:18:10+02:00

T3 aeon torp is great to snipe cruser (cost less in mass) then you can target the entire navy, with the other torp.
but if cruser got a shield, T3 aeon torp become useless.
so it's a good counter to cybran navy.

Statistics: Posted by keyser — 18 Apr 2014, 13:18

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-18T09:44:13+02:00

That's exactly right. The torp bomber does 4k damage, for a price I think less than the strat bomber. It also has a high hp and can drop torpedoes far earlier than a strat bomber can drop its bomb. The unit is very strong at both being a general assault weapon (it can kill cruisers in one pass and subhunters only have 500 hp left after one pass - which is the exact damage a t2 torp bomber does) or assassination weapon (ACUs can't stand under static shields when under water, the only mobile shields that always hit he ocean floor are the UEF shield boats and 5 torp bombers will kill any standard t3 ACU).

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 18 Apr 2014, 09:44

Re: Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-18T05:13:17+02:00

The data base is wrong. It reads the initial blueprints, but the torp splits into two when it hits the water. The actual damage is exactly double what is listed in the database.

Statistics: Posted by BRNKoINSANITY — 18 Apr 2014, 05:13

Aeun t3 Torp Bomber usless?

2014-04-18T05:30:08+02:00

i was looking at the unit data base and the t3 torp bomber does HALF the damage it used to do back in the GPG days. Was the torp bomber ever considered OP? Wasnt in commonly perceived that the Devs got the pricing of the Solace and the Restorer mixed, making the former weak and the latter broken? Aeon has weak torps anyway with no t3 subhunter or HARMS.

Statistics: Posted by LordFappington69 — 18 Apr 2014, 05:08