Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-30T23:41:43+02:00

Lame wrote:
sera is not exactly in a great place concerning subs (worst t1 sub no t2 sub worst torpedo bomber)

Please use the unit tester before posting about balance!

Sera destroyer kills all T1/T2 subs mass for mass with about 1k HP left. Sera destroyer is one of the best combat naval units in the game. Sera T3 combat sub is unique to Sera and is overpowered mass for mass (aka you instant win navy at later stages if your opponent is at equivalent economy).

Statistics: Posted by gnatinator — 30 Jan 2014, 23:41

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-30T22:25:24+02:00

Nothing is done to torpedo launcher's pitch ranges in Diamond. Otherwise it would read in the change log. In my eyes this is minor "problem" and can be also seen as feature just like being able to stand unharmed in the middle of the Yotha's death lightning ball as it has minimun range of 5.

Statistics: Posted by Vault54 — 30 Jan 2014, 22:25

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-30T14:48:46+02:00

Didn't Diamond Mod fix this ? And if yes didn't FAF integrate all the bugfixes from Diamond Mod ?

Statistics: Posted by Krapougnak — 30 Jan 2014, 14:48

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T19:07:50+02:00

Lame wrote:
what exactly was torp behavior before this fix?

sera is not exactly in a great place concerning subs (worst t1 sub no t2 sub worst torpedo bomber)

so blindly reverting it to a state where it can be killed by single t1 sub (if that was possible)
would be worse than sera having a better t1 torp launcher imo

Well, it depends on terrain. Sub always float at the same depth and aren't really a problem (although I think before my change, there was a small blindsport for them for subs.) However, with units on the ocean floor it's a big deal. At 30 degrees of firing arcs (arc being pitch + tolerance), in really shallow water this blind spot below the launcher is small, but in deep water this blind spot can be larger than the torpedo launcher's range. At 30 degrees, the ratio is blind spot radius = 2 * depth. So if the depth is half the max range of the torp launcher (which is 50... so half would be 25, which isn't even that much) congrats, you have a torp launcher that cannot shoot at targets on the ocean floor at any range. That's essentially what I was trying to avoid.

Also, from logical standpoint, torpedoes track so there really is no good reason why the firing tolerance shouldn't be 180 for all the launchers. Subs will launch torps when they aren't facing the target, as will destroyers, torp boats, and literally every ship/sub that have torpedoes or depth charges.

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 29 Jan 2014, 19:07

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T17:47:44+02:00

what exactly was torp behavior before this fix?

sera is not exactly in a great place concerning subs (worst t1 sub no t2 sub worst torpedo bomber)

so blindly reverting it to a state where it can be killed by single t1 sub (if that was possible)
would be worse than sera having a better t1 torp launcher imo

Statistics: Posted by Lame — 29 Jan 2014, 17:47

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T17:33:59+02:00

pip wrote:
The problem with this fix is that firing tolerance affects not only the pitch, but also the yaw of the weapon, making it significantly superior to all other torp launchers, for the reasons stated by Zlo. The unit startinng to shoot much faster to deal with threats coming from horizontal directions will occur much more than threats coming from underneath, not to mention the fact that no other torp launcher can efficiently shoot at underneath targets.

Technically, all torp launchers should be able to shoot straight down at 90 degrees. (Seraphim was the only one that couldn't do this before.) Actually, they can shoot straight down.... from the tip of the barrel. The problem, I'm assuming, is that the tip of the barrel isn't the exact center of the torp launcher, it's a little ways out of it, so the torp launchers all have a tiny ACU-sized blind spot.

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 29 Jan 2014, 17:33

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T16:17:37+02:00

The problem with this fix is that firing tolerance affects not only the pitch, but also the yaw of the weapon, making it significantly superior to all other torp launchers, for the reasons stated by Zlo. The unit startinng to shoot much faster to deal with threats coming from horizontal directions will occur much more than threats coming from underneath, not to mention the fact that no other torp launcher can efficiently shoot at underneath targets.

Statistics: Posted by pip — 29 Jan 2014, 16:17

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T14:24:07+02:00

well obviosly i posted a replay where i placed acu under all faction torpedo launchers, and nan of them can shoot acu under them (it is hard to do but still they can't)
i had most problems with cybran one btw xD

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 29 Jan 2014, 14:24

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T14:08:29+02:00

The seraphim T1 torp launcher is the only T1 torp launcher without a pitch bone, meaning that to actually aim up to down, the entire torpedo launcher has to rotate along the pitch axis, which IMO looks retarded. Therefore, I increased the firing tolerance to accommodate for this. It should be able to fire directly beneath itself because the pitch is 5 degrees + 85 for firing tolerance = 90 degrees straight down. In my tests, it was able to do this.

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 29 Jan 2014, 14:08

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T13:48:01+02:00

Could that be a mark of Funkoff's love for Sera? The power of love makes you do things outside the limits of reason...

Statistics: Posted by pip — 29 Jan 2014, 13:48

Re: Torpedo point defences

2014-01-29T12:32:26+02:00

Yeah I think it's a misupdate.

What should be updated IMO is the turret pitch -- in line with the other factions that have +/-60 (aeon, uef) and +/- 180(cybran).

It's crazy that that value is 05 for sera.

Statistics: Posted by Sheeo — 29 Jan 2014, 12:32

Torpedo point defences

2014-01-28T13:30:07+02:00

http://faforever.com/faf/unitsDB/unit.p ... 09,XSB2109
only for sera

firing tolerance: 85 #from 30 to allow shooting targets beneath

1) still not shoot under torp launcher if you put acu there
2) other torp point def do not have that

can anyone explain? or maybe it is only against subs?

i care cause it makes sera torp launcher much better against t1 navy that circling around it, since i would like to kill them before they get t2 navy

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 28 Jan 2014, 13:30