Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-24T09:17:39+02:00

Resin you still lurking in theses forums nice to hear from you.

Statistics: Posted by Krapougnak — 24 Jul 2013, 09:17

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-23T16:55:12+02:00

Domino had done some work on custom formations in 4DC.... maybe you should ask him.

Statistics: Posted by Resin_Smoker — 23 Jul 2013, 16:55

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T20:30:31+02:00

it is a community driven extended version of total annihilation, called spring engine. the game based on the spring engine is called zero-k.

Statistics: Posted by eXcalibur — 22 Jul 2013, 20:30

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T18:37:53+02:00

what is the game in the video?

Statistics: Posted by buletproof_bob — 22 Jul 2013, 18:37

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T16:45:46+02:00

All this things are cool but the proble is that i dont think they can be implemented

Statistics: Posted by StefanD_ — 22 Jul 2013, 16:45

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T15:51:56+02:00

this would be VERY useful as well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IVaKPjpsHU

you do no longer need templates for building buildings in rows or blocks with custom spacing and surrounding buildings with other buildings...

Statistics: Posted by eXcalibur — 22 Jul 2013, 15:51

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T09:25:10+02:00

Did you even watch the video?Cause personally i dont know what you are talking about when you say designing formations and redesigning them each game..Plz first watch the video that was dedicated to explaining the title of the topic.

Statistics: Posted by CopyyyCattt — 22 Jul 2013, 09:25

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T07:48:21+02:00

I made the previous suggestion because most players formation requirements are basic and universal. Also, most players do not wish to devote their attention to the complexity which formation design would require. When you look at what is happening, at the detailed level, with your formations. You will begin to understand that they are actually quite complicated.

There are actually a couple of things which the current formation system does quite well and it is easily controlled within the game. The formation for any group of units can be assigned by: >> [Hold Right] + [Left Click]. Groups will remember their assigned formation. With the 4 formations options above: (Line, Box, Chevron & Circle) I would consider adding an additional 2 formations to this cycle que. But they would be assigned in exactly the same manner in game. The in game controls should be intuitive and basic. It should not require an additional HUD element.

When you look at existing formations, they do several things really well:
1. They bring the heavy direct fire units to the front of the formation
2. They bring the AA units behind the direct fire units
3. They put indirect fire units in the rear
4. They evenly space mobile shields and stealth units to protect the whole formation.

Most players would not have the knowledge, the interest or the inclination to design formations. They just expect them to work. We don't really need a tool to design custom formations and we most certainly do not want to have to re-create them every game! We just need to expand on the concept and fix some of the outstanding formation issues. Sometimes the simplest solution is usually the best.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 22 Jul 2013, 07:48

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T06:47:40+02:00

Well, the advantage of the custom formation system shown in the video is that it is seamless.
Anything of this sort that is added must work as fast and convenient or more than how it works now.
The formation drawing i done jsut by holding and moving the mouse..There is no delay like with the formation move or any need to press any new buttons.

Any system of this sort added must work conveniently under the most intense high micro 1v1 games.
If it doesnt work there it ius badly designed and should not be added in the first place.

The game shown in the video has less units in an average game than supcom. There, 1 or 2 lines is usually enough.
In supcom t1 spam can get pretty massive at times.
IMO the Ideal fusion of both is being able to draw the formation structure, a straight line, a semi circle or whatever else as it is done in the video but, based on the amount of units you got and the length of the drawn line the lua widget decided into how many lines to divide the formation.

I'm not sure if supcom, being the hectic RTS game that it is, can have a formation widget that can sort out any mixture of units and place them all in the way most players would want, most of the time.
The amount of mixes would be crazy even for one formation type not to mention many different formations, and the widget having to be able to choose how to order different types of units for every formation type...

Statistics: Posted by CopyyyCattt — 22 Jul 2013, 06:47

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-22T04:21:53+02:00

We don't really need custom formations, we just need a few formations which are useful.

The problems I see with the current formations are that:

1. There are currenly only two rectangular formations, "Line" and "Box";
2. These formations do not allow for the positioning of different tech levels;
3. That when different tech levels of naval vessels are grouped together, the formation will expand too far.

I would recommend that formations be expanded to include "Chevron" and "Circle" formations. I would also recommend that these formations contain some variety on priority within the formation. Or instance, having a "Heavy Lead" and "Light Lead" formations which would put all the heavy units to the front or the rear of the formation. As well options for a "Heavy Center" formation. Which would put the higher tech units to the center of the formation, with a perimeter of lighter units surrounding them.

I would envisage the most useful formations would look something like the following:
Line - The default rectangular formation with a higher width to depth aspect ratio. Heavy lead main battle line formation.
Box - A defensive rectangular formation with equal width to depth aspect ratio (ie. square). Heavy units are placed around the entire perimeter.
Chevron - A modified "V" shape assault formation. With Heavy units placed on the leading edges of the chevron.
Circle - This is a light unit defensive formation. Where a vunerable High tech unit is surrounded by a picket line of smaller units. This is a light lead formation.

I also think that the spacing of different tech levels in naval formations need to be reworked. Such that the T3 vessels are given a larger spacing, and the T1/T2 vessels given a smaller spacing. With the two matricies coinciding. As it currently stands, mixed tech naval formations are unwieldy, and unworkable.The only way I can effectively operate my navies is to have my T2 escorts in an entierly separate group.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 22 Jul 2013, 04:21

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-21T09:19:58+02:00

Back in the days a guy called Domino made some new formations and included them in his mod, Domino Mod Support (DMS)

Statistics: Posted by Krapougnak — 21 Jul 2013, 09:19

Re: Custom formations

2013-07-20T17:27:40+02:00

CopyyyCattt wrote:
Eh...This is for all the coders here.
Maybe one of you will find it inspiring enough to implement it in FA(if that is even possible).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRNxdbEx6v8

It would be too cool if its possible!:D

Statistics: Posted by StefanD_ — 20 Jul 2013, 17:27

Custom formations

2013-07-20T15:49:23+02:00

Eh...This is for all the coders here.
Maybe one of you will find it inspiring enough to implement it in FA(if that is even possible).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRNxdbEx6v8

Statistics: Posted by CopyyyCattt — 20 Jul 2013, 15:49