Forged Alliance Forever

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T16:46:07+02:00

I hear ya, bud.

Best advice I can offer up is to ensure you are fully free on time and internet is stable before playing.

I know that can't be determined all the time but it's the best feedback I have to give : (

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 25 Aug 2017, 16:46

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T16:09:39+02:00

you could do a very small penalty -5pts/draw for each player, or even "n free draws/week"(not sure if this would be hard to implement). The first option would work well for the current small ladder map pool rotation, it gives the option for people to either not be competitive by quitting frequently (abusive), or the occasional penalty that wont damage their attempts to climb ladder (non-abusive). The second option allows people to mess up their timing a bit, or have 1/2 unexpected connection interruptions and not be penalised at all.

Statistics: Posted by soilworker — 25 Aug 2017, 16:09

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T16:03:45+02:00

You may be right, Morax, it could be a case of better and worse rather than right or wrong. But it's easier to make appropriate decisions if we understand why the current systems are in place. If it's simply to dishearten people from quitting maps they don't like, then I think it can be done better by being a less severe penalty, and an even penalty to both players (I'm not sure if it's both players or just the higher ranked that gets the penalty).

Statistics: Posted by soilworker — 25 Aug 2017, 16:03

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T14:54:21+02:00

soilworker wrote:
there is enough discussion on the ladder thread already on that sort of stuff. Added voices doesn't benefit it much more. Also it was just an example.

No, this is just not right: if you don't like something add your voice as the statistics do count. If people are silent issues will not be resolved.

Give feedback and let Tokyto_ know.

As for the draw mechanic in terms of disconnects, it's an unfortunate side effect of a system in place. If you remove the loss of points from draws people will also be able to use it for reasons such as agreeing to not play a map because they don't like it.

I don't think you can make it so it's both not abused and 100% fair.

In short, I agree it sucks... But what to do better?

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 25 Aug 2017, 14:54

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T13:36:36+02:00

What do you suggest is a better system?

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 25 Aug 2017, 13:36

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-25T12:30:04+02:00

there is enough discussion on the ladder thread already on that sort of stuff. Added voices doesn't benefit it much more. Also it was just an example.
Who said refusing to play on a given map? an odd choice of words. I'm talking about when we agree we want to play on a better map, and not only solely because of the map (that you seem caught on discussing) but also because of other events as I mentioned above.

I might reword my original question and maybe you can answer it, aye Morax? what is the logic in losing points in a draw when it's not a matter of skill or opinion?

Statistics: Posted by soilworker — 25 Aug 2017, 12:30

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-24T17:40:47+02:00

As for the "choosing favorite team game maps" please discuss that on the ladder pool thread so that he can draw in that feedback. The current pool is leagues better thanks to criticism.

For the "sportsmanship" part, I think it"unsportsmanlike" to refuse to play on a particular "field."

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 24 Aug 2017, 17:40

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-24T15:25:37+02:00

A few of the previous ladder rotations haven't been about wit and skill, they've been about a lazy moderator putting in their favourite 4v4 team fight maps (that are horridly bland for 1v1). Also, say I have a frequent opponent who announces they only have 20 min to play a quick match, but we've drawn Roanoke abyss, I'm more keen to look after my buddy and have a competitive good game on a smaller faster map than have them quit because they ran out of time.
I'll provide another scenario too. Unexpected connection issues part way into a match means the only fair way to end the game is to offer a draw, however the higher ranked opponent still loses points. Yes, you could say that the person with a bad connection deserves to lose, but I prefer my matches to be about wit and skill, not an internet connection.
Your second point doesn't really answer my question at all though... I'm not talking about combat draws where the better player should have known better, I agree that in that case that the better play should lose out, I made that clear in my post... I'm interested when it's not a matter of skill determining if we draw, but of enjoying FAF. I don't think the current approach encourages sportsmanship.

Statistics: Posted by soilworker — 24 Aug 2017, 15:25

Re: draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-24T14:42:26+02:00

First, choosing to not play a ladder game because you don't like the map is not very conducive to creating a competitive system. If people only play the maps they like and build rating it won't truly show someone's wit and skill in a diverse set of situations.

Second, I think it proper that a higher rated player is at a disadvantage when it comes to draws. It needs to be assumed that says player is "better" and should not have to draw to end a game. Make sense? It also prevents people from cherry-picking their matches per my statements above.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 24 Aug 2017, 14:42

draw mechanic and losing points

2017-08-24T07:07:36+02:00

Yo,

Can someone explain the logic of losing points when both players consent early in a match to a draw (through the diplomacy window)?
I appreciate why when two players blow up simultaneously, that the higher ranked player might lose points. But not when neither player likes the ladder map and wants to re-queue for a better game.

Statistics: Posted by soilworker — 24 Aug 2017, 07:07