Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T20:41:20+02:00

theres no mystery at all with these tbh - you can find all, and i do mean all, you need to know about building adjacency from this one table here:

https://github.com/FAForever/fa/blame/develop/lua/sim/AdjacencyBuffs.lua

by using git blame we can also find out when it was changed. a year ago is the last time it COULD have been changed, but that was a code improvement rather than a balance change, and before that it needs more looking at since the structure was completely different.

Statistics: Posted by Exotic_Retard — 20 Jan 2017, 20:41

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T20:35:12+02:00

No ZLO those numbers are not changed. I tested them in game and normally there is shown x,x value but you can see in game always full number so i expect them to be precise. The adjacency system was patched i told you. In former times directly after introducing engi mod and for some time. In this period of time it was far the most efficient adjacency for air facs to built continental and t2 bombers. For Land facs it was more adjacency for riptide tanks than for percivals 5 vs 4 mass per/tick saving. I somehow missed the point when it was changed but i remember i read it in a patch. It was definately changed all this adjacency system i think crotalus knows the changes.

Statistics: Posted by Iszh — 20 Jan 2017, 20:35

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T17:03:53+02:00

Nope, I'm serious. I always thought walls gave merely ballistic protection; didnt know about adjacency health boost.

Statistics: Posted by RocketRooster — 20 Jan 2017, 17:03

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T17:02:09+02:00

Iszh wrote:
ZLO_RD wrote:Best mass adjustency is not for percies, it is for continentals (-32 mass per sec), for other factions it is strats (-30 mass per sec).
Adjustency is pretty usefull for structures that have big build power, and t3 air fac has more build power than t3 land fac. T3 pgen adjustency to t3 air fac is pretty insane for asf production.

Good that shows that i am not the only one who missed thosed adjacency changes.

t3 mex adjacency with t3 air fac: (saving mass/tick)
t2 janus 3
Spyplane 4
ASF 2
Gunship 3
Bomber 4
Continental 4

T3 mass fab adjacency with t3 air fac: (saving mass/tick)
t2 janus 3
Spyplane 6
ASF 3
Gunship 5
Bomber 5
Continental 7

Can you see the difference? The adjacency was changed within the last year i beleave. I know 100% sure that a riptide costed 5 mass/ tick less in a t3 land fac, thats not the samt atm. I have no information about the new adjacency system atm, can somebody please post a link?

You want to say that wiki has incorrect data or what?
Because i thoguht making t3 bomber in t3 fac that is adjacent to t3 mass fab should give exactly 6 mass discount.
and you also rounded all numbers there.

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 20 Jan 2017, 17:02

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T16:42:48+02:00

Someone might also want to update the quantum gateway reference on the adjacency wiki site since the 3650 patch nerfed the bonus a lot.

Statistics: Posted by PhilipJFry — 20 Jan 2017, 16:42

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T16:39:34+02:00

ZLO_RD wrote:
Best mass adjustency is not for percies, it is for continentals (-32 mass per sec), for other factions it is strats (-30 mass per sec).
Adjustency is pretty usefull for structures that have big build power, and t3 air fac has more build power than t3 land fac. T3 pgen adjustency to t3 air fac is pretty insane for asf production.

Good that shows that i am not the only one who missed thosed adjacency changes.

t3 mex adjacency with t3 air fac: (saving mass/tick)
t2 janus 3
Spyplane 4
ASF 2
Gunship 3
Bomber 4
Continental 4

T3 mass fab adjacency with t3 air fac: (saving mass/tick)
t2 janus 3
Spyplane 6
ASF 3
Gunship 5
Bomber 5
Continental 7

Can you see the difference? The adjacency was changed within the last year i beleave. I know 100% sure that a riptide costed 5 mass/ tick less in a t3 land fac, thats not the samt atm. I have no information about the new adjacency system atm, can somebody please post a link?

Statistics: Posted by Iszh — 20 Jan 2017, 16:39

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T16:33:40+02:00

RocketRooster wrote:
dinnae know about the health boost from walls. good to know.

Please tell me you're not serious

Statistics: Posted by Gorton — 20 Jan 2017, 16:33

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T15:11:27+02:00

dinnae know about the health boost from walls. good to know.

Statistics: Posted by RocketRooster — 20 Jan 2017, 15:11

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T13:34:37+02:00

Best mass adjustency is not for percies, it is for continentals (-32 mass per sec), for other factions it is strats (-30 mass per sec).
Adjustency is pretty usefull for structures that have big build power, and t3 air fac has more build power than t3 land fac. T3 pgen adjustency to t3 air fac is pretty insane for asf production.

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 20 Jan 2017, 13:34

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T11:51:49+02:00

speed2 wrote:
And factory to factory adjacency to increase build power and let's not forget wall adjacency, each adjacent wall increases HP and prettiness of your base.

Adjacent walls with 4 connections get flower pots on top or fountains for a nice base!

Can somebody tell me when adjacency was changed? One year ago perci used 4 mass less next to a t3 mex and a riptide tank even 5. Atm all units in uef factory use 3 mass less and MML and t3 arti use 2 mass less. This was changed not long time ago. Where are the new infos about this how it works atm?

Statistics: Posted by Iszh — 20 Jan 2017, 11:51

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T11:39:01+02:00

And factory to factory adjacency to increase build power and let's not forget wall adjacency, each adjacent wall increases HP and prettiness of your base.

Statistics: Posted by speed2 — 20 Jan 2017, 11:39

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T11:35:50+02:00

It would be a nice decision to provide a dependent positive and negative adjacency for storages. For example t3 mass fabs have only adjacency if they are switched on. It is more or less understandable that production units give adjacency for production. But isnt a storage next to a production as well useful especially if it is connected directly to a pgen or mex.

A nice suggestion would be to add adjacency to reduce cost for

mass storages connected to a production
energy storages connected to production

So you could built the usual storage built arround the mexes and connect to 2 storages a factory in the corner which gets adjacency again. Wouldd be funny to see in future t3 radar template with t3 radar 4 e storages arround and 4 pegens arround the storages 3x3 cube. And factories in the corners of mass storrages instead of t2 mass fabs. Interesting would be as well a construction for t3 mass fabs with 6 e storages and 6 mass sotrages arround which are connected to t3 pgens and factories. That would be funny stuff

Statistics: Posted by Iszh — 20 Jan 2017, 11:35

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T11:16:03+02:00

a couple of clarifications:

engies getting a discount does not hurt the actual saving of the factory - it will always save 12.5% mass on every unit it builds when next to a t3 mex.
while it would be great if they did, a feature of engy mod is that you can kinda emulate that by building support factories next to mexes. however its only worth it for convenience (roll of time, ect), on paper engies are better.

the thing to balance (ha-ha) here is the discount per unit vs the mass rate that having a mass storage instead of a factory would give.
having it build cheaper units is only relevant due to roll-off time - if you build mantis, interestingly the fac drains the same amount as if you build bricks, so the difference in mass rate is the same.
likewise, quantum gateways have lower adjacency bonuses but also drain more mass so it kinda evens out.
also there are some exceptions to the rules in the wiki, like the t3 mass fab having some strange numbers for everything thats not a factory

currently, it is correct that the most efficient thing is to have all facs adjacent to t3 mexes. however, that's not the best thing, since the advantage is rather small (max 0.25mass/s per adjacent fac), and current meta focuses of rushing things like exps where the extra mass income is worth more than extra units.

Statistics: Posted by Exotic_Retard — 20 Jan 2017, 11:16

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T10:03:19+02:00

Depends on what you're building, too. Ferinstance, if you're building Percies, you get the best mass discount. T1 and T2 stuff does not get the same discount. and it's better to have storage adjancency iirc.And if you pause constuction then obviously you get nada bonus whatsoever. Keep in mind that assisting engies and stations do not get a bonus at all.

Statistics: Posted by RocketRooster — 20 Jan 2017, 10:03

Re: Adjacency bonuses

2017-01-20T09:23:45+02:00

Xyx wrote:
I should always place land factories adjacent to mexes, given the opportunity.

The bonus in the early game is quite substantial but since t2/t3 mex benefit a lot from storages and you usually increase your production by supporting a factory with engis (which don't get the adjacency bonus) you probably don't want them there later on.

Xyx wrote:
I should try to place my quantum gateway adjacent to a mex, even if that means I have to reclaim a storage.

Note: Quantum gateways only receive 15%.

no, also engis still get no adjacency bonus

Xyx wrote:
4 T1 PGens provide the same fire rate bonus to T3 artillery as 1 T3 PGen (but there's less risk of destroying the arty in a chain reaction.)

In this table the discount percentages are shown for a fully surrounded structure.

Statistics: Posted by PhilipJFry — 20 Jan 2017, 09:23