Forged Alliance Forever

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-09T02:23:16+02:00

The other reason people use T2 artillery is for coastal defence vs. naval. It is not cost effective. But in sufficient numbers and with adequate shielding, they can defend against Destroyer bombardment. Once the sea is lost, this can be an effective countermeasure, stalling the naval player, and buying time.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 09 May 2016, 02:23

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-07T23:39:56+02:00

I don't believe that the issue has been addressed at any point. I would recommend that the minimum firing angle be changed to 0 so that the cannon cannot be deflected downward.

What about people that place their arty at the edge of hills to shoot down?

Statistics: Posted by Zock — 07 May 2016, 23:39

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-07T22:40:57+02:00

Exotic_Retard wrote:
Exotic_Retard wrote:will look into this later.
so later came.

...

you can play with these changes in equilibrium in a couple weeks time (today if you get the dev version), and probably never in the base game. enjoy.

Thank you for looking into this ER, it is most appreciated. If you have time (I am not clear on the politics around here), could you explain why this will "probably never" end up "in the base game" (presumably you mean vanilla FAF)?

I will look forward to trying it out in equilibrium!

Statistics: Posted by piratep2r — 07 May 2016, 22:40

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-07T01:27:50+02:00

indeed. i recall that experimental nuke was added to the exception list at some relatively recent point

Statistics: Posted by Exotic_Retard — 07 May 2016, 01:27

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-06T20:27:46+02:00

Exotic_Retard wrote:
Exotic_Retard wrote:will look into this later.

interestingly, it seems that a unit cannot harm itself. during testing i made arty shoot at point blank range into the ground and 0 damage. however things behind and in front of it all got damaged by its shots. i would conclude that someone thought about this in the past (gpg?)

i want to say again that there is almost no units that can damage themself in this game, there are VERY few exeptions like nukes and i don't know what else (maybe billy)... scatis and t3 cybran arty can technicaly damage themself, but they only do 3-5 damage per shot with that wide range sparkle effect, but i could not find any other units that can damage themself, no TMLS (they only do damage to yourself when they are deflected by loyalist), no Battleships, nothing, they can only do friendly fire, but not harm themself

ZLO_RD wrote:
also it may help a bit to remember that arty can't damage itself, so if you space it out enought it may get better (they will still shoot into the ground i guess, it can also depleate shield that covers them )

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 06 May 2016, 20:27

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-06T19:39:35+02:00

Iszh wrote:
yes it is nice fatboy defense in team games sometimes nice to annoy the enemy if you are in range of base. And so on. .... .

Ugh, in late game it's incredibly effective to defend against all T4 land units, t2 arty creep can slaughter, and just one mid-game within range of core mexes will make life absolutely miserable for someone without 2+ shields.

They're expensive as hell for a reason and are a very viable static-offense strategy.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 06 May 2016, 19:39

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-05-06T19:27:11+02:00

Exotic_Retard wrote:
will look into this later.

so later came.

yes, friendly fire off is one of the very few options available. the other is to increase minimum range, and i think it should be done regardless since you atm can just groundfire and almost hit yourself anyway.

interestingly, it seems that a unit cannot harm itself. during testing i made arty shoot at point blank range into the ground and 0 damage. however things behind and in front of it all got damaged by its shots. i would conclude that someone thought about this in the past (gpg?)

i was actually going to do some overly complicated method, involving projectile scripts but unfortunately i could not find a way to toggle friendly damage on the fly (without spawning a new projectile, which seems like a ludicrous solution for this) so FF off it is. oh well.

also i gave it code to reduce its muzzle velocity on its target range so it doesn't shoot as parallel to the ground and with absurd spread on lower ranges; just like the scathis.

you can play with these changes in equilibrium in a couple weeks time (today if you get the dev version), and probably never in the base game. enjoy.

Spoiler: show

Statistics: Posted by Exotic_Retard — 06 May 2016, 19:27

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-29T09:25:23+02:00

The issue has always existed. I've solved this problem by:
1. Positioning arty to avoid FF;
2. Having sufficient PD to ensure nothing gets that close; and
3. Manually selecting targets, and force the arty to shoot targets which are further away.

I don't believe that the issue has been addressed at any point. I would recommend that the minimum firing angle be changed to 0 so that the cannon cannot be deflected downward. Or a minimum angle be tested to prevent FF when firing at short range over the cusp of a hill.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 29 Apr 2016, 09:25

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-28T18:11:14+02:00

ZLO_RD wrote:
issue does exist, but imho it is not very big issue,

Never claimed that it was - I think you are right. But I am looking for reasons to love the building, and it is currently somewhat hard.

ZLO_RD wrote:
ionly fix i see is to make arty not shoot at all if it is going to hit terrain, witch is probably not easy to implement, or make it shoot higher arc in cases when turret attempts to fire at angle that is below 0 degrees from ground, or make it change muzzle velocity and always shoot at relatively high arc, and decrese muzzle velocity as target gets closer, but that is probably impossible to implement in game

Seems like good possible solutions. TY.

Exotic_Retard wrote:
friendly fire off seems like the most obvious choice here. will look into this later.

Thank you; ending up on your "gonna look into it at some point" list is actually pretty cool.

HUSSAR wrote:
I reproduced this issue in replay ID 4700942 and I reported this issue on github.
https://github.com/FAForever/fa/issues/1227

Also, I added your suggestions/fixes so DEV team will discuss it there and try to fix it.

Thank you Hussar; I should have posted a replay or at least a video, and I am in your debt. You rock!

Statistics: Posted by piratep2r — 28 Apr 2016, 18:11

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-28T17:12:48+02:00

I reproduced this issue in replay ID 4700942 and I reported this issue on github.
https://github.com/FAForever/fa/issues/1227

Also, I added your suggestions/fixes so DEV team will discuss it there and try to fix it.

Statistics: Posted by HUSSAR — 28 Apr 2016, 17:12

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-28T17:07:19+02:00

yes it is nice fatboy defense in team games sometimes nice to annoy the enemy if you are in range of base. And so on. .... .

Statistics: Posted by Iszh — 28 Apr 2016, 17:07

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-28T17:06:17+02:00

Wait, there are people who actually use T2 arty?

Statistics: Posted by zeroAPM — 28 Apr 2016, 17:06

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-28T16:16:11+02:00

Exotic_Retard wrote:
friendly fire off seems like the most obvious choice here. will look into this later.

Wait, this wouldn't be fixed in equilibrium ?

Statistics: Posted by Zoram — 28 Apr 2016, 16:16

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-27T22:27:12+02:00

friendly fire off seems like the most obvious choice here. will look into this later.

Statistics: Posted by Exotic_Retard — 27 Apr 2016, 22:27

Re: T2 static arty blows itself up. This sucks. Can it be fi

2016-04-27T20:45:45+02:00

Other solutions are increasing min range or deactivating friendly fire, i guess

Statistics: Posted by angus000 — 27 Apr 2016, 20:45