Zock wrote:
To keep this thread tidy and open for different suggestions we (Rienzilla and me) want to introduce and discuss the engy redesign mod in this Thread.




tl;dr version


(thanks to Anti-Distinctly for the picture)


-We make multiple t2/t3 factories and t2/t3 engies to build and assist cost efficient instead of only t1 engies to each build and assist as it currently is.
-you can still play the old way and assist/build with t1 engies.
-The normal factory is rennamed to t2/t3 factory Headquater
-if you have at least one Headquster you can also make new cheap factories, but if you lose all Headquaters, this factories can make only t1 units until you make a new one.
-This changes are complicated and need some carefull changes, but in the game, you won't notice that, it will be simpler while also beeing more strategic (and less lag) then the current balance.
-its a featured mod and you can easy test it and tell us your experience!


last changelog:

Code:


Engymod version 90 has just been uploaded. It has various fixes:

- Re-adjusted buildpower of SCU
- adjust buildtimes of ACU/SCU upgrades to reflect increased buildpower
- adjusted buildrates of all upgradeable buildings (mexes, shields, radars etc) to reflect their buildtime increase
- nerfed mex adjacency to compensate for factories with more bp (t1 mex 7.5%, t2 mex 10%, t3 mex 12.5%)
- fix buildtime of HQs according their buildpower increase
- fixed cost of aeon t3 slave airfac



to do list and problems


Prio high:
- Crash when canceling t3 upgrade in factory queue while t2 upgrade is building (crashes when t2 fac finished building)
- UEF models missing

Prio medium
- Separate unit buildmenu icons for HQ's
- Cybran t2 air factory has broken low-res texture
- Aeon t3 land factory is too bright

Prio low
- spawning a hq with cheat menu doesnt unlock supportfacs
- Add unitnames for credits
- UI does not indicate correct upgrade cost for a queued upgrade (so in a t1 building, cost indication for t2 upgrade is correct, but for subsequent t3 it is not)



old changelogs:









tl version

What is it about?

Right now it is not efficient to make more then one higher tech factory (i use the t2 factory as example from now, but the same applies for t3 all the time), instead it is more cost efficient to make t1 engies and assist one single t2 factory until you struggle over pathfinding problems.

Also, it is not efficient to build structures with t2/t3 (i will aswell use t2 engies as example from now) engies, it is only cost efficient to make only one t2 engy, and then assist with t1 ones.

This problems are there since Vanilla, and got adressed by GPG in FA, yet they didn't manage to solve them. We are working on a mod that solves this problems and replace them with a solution that allows more strategy, is more intuitive for new players, less annoying to play with due to less pathfinding problems and less lag producing.

The goals

Primary:
-Make multiple factories cost efficient and no mistake to build
-Make higher tech engies as build and assist unit efficient

Secondary:
-Keep the current flow of the game as much as possible
-The solution should be intuitive and easy to understand
-Make assisting not useless

What the mod does to archive the goals

Now, there are many different solutions submitted to adress this problems. Some are older then FA, and most of them won't work for simple reasons, other may work but will have a huge impact on the gameplay, as it is very hard to change engies/factories, and keep the current gameplay as it is.

So we did a combination of changes, first the ones that were needed to fulfill the main goals:

-Increase the buildpower of t2 engies to make them as efficient as t1 engies mass/buildpower
-Split the cost for a t2 factory into a reseach and a buildpower part (that are both currently there, but combined in the upgrade). The buildpower part is the new t2 factory, and mass/buildpower as efficient as t1 engies.

To solve problems that are caused by this change alone, additional changes were:

-The now split reseach costs for t2 are outsourced into a new building. It is also possible to have them as another upgrade, we decided for a building for the reasons that it should be destroyable (and upgrade wouldn't be) and that it easier to understand for new players then 2 upgrades of one factory.

-The new t2 engies (that are equal masswise to t1 engies) would be able to build defence (and others) structures much faster then t1 engies, because they suffer less pathfinding issues. The time to make a building is currently "time to get there + time to build it". With t1 engies, the time to get there is quite high compared to the actualy buildtime, because all the bumping, that t2 engies don't got so much. Now thats not enough, but the %, the "time to get there" takes on the overall buildtime, is much higher for buildings with low buildtime (i.e. , if you make a t2 PD, the time to get there will propably be 50% of the overall buildtime with 10 t1 engies, if you make a nuke, it will be like 0,1%)

So we want to buff the t2 engy, but not that much that it can build faster then now, while we make it equal to t1 engies at building/assisting. All that without touching the t1 engy, because that would break the t1 stage.

The solution for this is to increase the buildtime of all t2 buildings. With this way, we can keep the overall buildtime (walking + building) the same compared to before.
As welcome side effect, t1 engies will be slightly less efficient at assiting t2 buildings. It is still well doable, but it will be better to use t2 engies. Because low buildtime structures need more buildtime increase then high buildtime structures, as stated above, we use the following formula to calculate the new buildtime: oldbt*(1+0.75/(1.5**oldbt/400))

This makes t2 engies not as good at assisting as t1 engies (but still close, much better then now, where they are useless), but you will be more flexible with t2 engies and can build structures better.

-to make the game more intuitive and more comfortable, t2 engies can now build t2 factories. (temporary removed due to technical issues)

The exact changes are in the attached pdf. A changed unit stat compared to faf3621 is highlighted in orange.

known results

-Multiple factories are no mistake to do and an alternative to assisting a single factory.
-The old way of assisting a single t2 (keep in mind that all applies also to t3) factory with lots of t1 engies is still viable.
-This assisting can be done with t1 or t2 (still same for t3) engies, each got advantages and disadvantages, but it is excepted that you will have more higher tech engies compared to t1 as longer the game goes (just like with any other unit type)
-Making t2 buildings is a little slower then before if you use many t1 engies to assist, but still good doable, it is about the same as before when you use t2 engies.
-Sniping the enemy techbuilding is rewarding.

-making t1 buildings with higher tech engies (and ACU suit, SCUs..) is a lot faster now. We are working on this problem.


how to get/play this mod?

Its a featured mod in FAF. Just host a game with it and tell us your experience with it. I'd appreciate if anyone who got (always welcome) critic or suggestions to the mod could at least test the mod on his concerns once before.


why don't you just... instead of all that changes

-Increase buildpower of t2/t3 engies
As written above it would make tower creeps OP and it gets too easy to react on any threat with a few t3 engies in seconds

-Increase factory buildpower
This would be a huge buff to t2/t3, as you could produce a lot more units early.

-Reduce assisting power of t1 engies
This would slow the game down, as you would lack the cheap buildpower and end up with less units

-Limit the amount of engies a factory can have
Hard limits are almost always a worse idea then a dynamic solution.

Alternatives we considered:

Make the first factory expensive, all following cheap. This will be bad gamedesign. Things shoulnd't suddenly change costs in the game. It wouldn't be destroyable aswell.