Forged Alliance Forever

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-08-06T10:29:42+02:00

tatsu wrote:
loosing your ride and a chunk of HP in enemy territory just means your chances of survival dropped from slim to slimer.

You think so? I feel like in a lot of circumstances it wouldn't make that much difference. If you have a lot of regen from upgrades and/or veterancy the damage might not be that significant - with the extra time you'll have to spend walking, by the time you get to your destination you very well may have most of your health back. Also, if you're just moving a com into TML range, not direct combat, it wouldn't really matter much if your health is low when you crash, as you're not going directly into harm's way. Your opponent's reward for noticing and intercepting the transport would be the same as if he didn't: a hail of missiles.

Also, how would this work with shields? Could a commander just turn his shield off before he hops on the transport, and if it gets shot down just toggle shield back on? Not too detrimental, unless the deactivated shield still takes damage as well, which seems rather nonsensical.

Statistics: Posted by Mycen — 06 Aug 2015, 10:29

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-08-05T14:51:35+02:00

There's a line of code that gives every unit in a transport a 0.005 chance to survive a crash.

Statistics: Posted by ColonelSheppard — 05 Aug 2015, 14:51

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-08-01T01:36:45+02:00

Might be slightly off topic but does anyone know why sometimes units randomly survive their transport getting shot down?

Statistics: Posted by Deering — 01 Aug 2015, 01:36

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-30T15:41:02+02:00

it could be interesting, though. If you're taking a transport out rather than walking it means you REEEEEEALLY wanna get out of there in the first place. loosing your ride and a chunk of HP in enemy territory just means your chances of survival dropped from slim to slimer.

Statistics: Posted by tatsu — 30 Jul 2015, 15:41

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-30T11:50:18+02:00

It was intended, at the start of game development, to have units die when the transport gets shot. This has never been changed and a change is interesting. While I think it's rather logical that a unit dies in mid flight (height is massive), the fact that units die when the transport is in the unload process, is a bit weird.

You could make it height related and let the ACU and other amphibious or hover units get a damage reduction if they're above water.

There is a serious balance thing involved though. If you can let the ACU survive a transport crash, then the ACUs with super attack power will become rather overpowered. The chance of seeing them coming and anticipating is greatly reduced, especially in the case of the stealth transport of the Cybrans. If we leave things as they are, then the risk that come with an instakill of losing the transport was a decent balance. If the opponent spots you, a quick ASF strike will leave you powerless. With a change, not only does the opponent have to spot you in time, he also has to make sure he surprises you in turn, with the ASFs. If you see those fighters coming, a sudden drop order will let your ACU live as it is just being dropped when the ASFs fire.

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 30 Jul 2015, 11:50

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-30T02:21:58+02:00

codepants wrote:
vtine85 wrote:I know I don't have the ranking or expertise to join any "serious" discussion of this, but I would see this encouraging com drops. As awesome as a well placed com drop can be, there is significant risk in doing it, and that risk should remain.

2nd. This would make it basically risk-free to try and do com drops. As is a mazercom requires teleport. This would remove that need -- just grab a mobile stealth, fly the transport as close as you can to your opponent, and when it gets shot down, start walking.

Yeah the tele part is pretty pricey compared to just the lazor

Statistics: Posted by KD7BCH — 30 Jul 2015, 02:21

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-29T19:05:23+02:00

vtine85 wrote:
I know I don't have the ranking or expertise to join any "serious" discussion of this, but I would see this encouraging com drops. As awesome as a well placed com drop can be, there is significant risk in doing it, and that risk should remain.

2nd. This would make it basically risk-free to try and do com drops. As is a mazercom requires teleport. This would remove that need -- just grab a mobile stealth, fly the transport as close as you can to your opponent, and when it gets shot down, start walking.

Statistics: Posted by codepants — 29 Jul 2015, 19:05

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-29T17:30:28+02:00

Yeah 4 Cybran commanders all sequentially upgrading their MAZER, and then transporting into battle that would be a kick ass struggle to try to kill them all. You'd probably get half of them but half would get through to destroy a base and probably kill another ACU before it was stopped, especially with air cover.

Statistics: Posted by KD7BCH — 29 Jul 2015, 17:30

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-29T16:56:06+02:00

I know I don't have the ranking or expertise to join any "serious" discussion of this, but I would see this encouraging com drops. As awesome as a well placed com drop can be, there is significant risk in doing it, and that risk should remain.

Statistics: Posted by vtine85 — 29 Jul 2015, 16:56

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-29T12:22:34+02:00

I think it might be fun if units didn't die falling off transports, but took fall damage based on their type. Tanks and trucks take ~80% max hp, hover is cushioned and takes 60%, and units with legs (bots) can absorb the shock and only take 40% of their max HP as damage. ACU counts as a robot, of course.

In terms of actual game balance impact, I don't think it would change up too much. If someone has to airlift their Com out of a situation and it gets shot down then they'll probably die anyway in short order as the units overrunning the position they were evacuating from catch up with the downed ACU who just took a huge HP hit. It might be tricky with engineer drops, as a single engineer surviving a drop can have a huge impact. However, engineers are usually dropped to either a) an inaccessible location or b) a very far away location. So if the transport gets shot down in situation a) then the drop was effectively thwarted as the engineers can't get to their intended location, and if it was situation b) then the engineers will have to walk the rest of the way, and are now very fragile and could easily be killed by LABs or raiding units.

Also of interest would be the impact of AA weapons on transported units. Flack already shoots off T1 units from transports before the transport itself blows up, and I've seen T1 aeon engies tank shots intended for their Chariot more than once. So most units in a transport being shot down would still die, but there might be some survivors.

If units land on terrain they can't normally stand on they just die instantly, right? That's what happens when you drop harbies in the water. So we just need to make sure that the ACU can't land halfway up a mountain and get stuck.

Statistics: Posted by ZenTractor — 29 Jul 2015, 12:22

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-29T00:16:12+02:00

it's kinda crazy to me that when a crazy-ass idea like this is brought up it gets seriously debated. but when you try that with com-blocking a non-mechanic meta-made part of the game nooooooo. Don't touch our presssiousssesss!

...maybe it just has to do the name of the person who brings it up...?

I was kidding around. It wasn't a serious example of how I think the game should work. Just typed it up so people could have a good laugh. Glad you enjoyed it.

Statistics: Posted by DarkTemplar — 29 Jul 2015, 00:16

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-28T23:21:45+02:00

Misaniovent wrote:
Not only is a good mechanic, but we should return to the Total Annihilation days when transports could kidnap enemy ACUs.

OMG really? that's hilarious!

DarkTemplar wrote:
I think your UI should zoom in to the cockpit of the ACU. Red lights flash everywhere. ALERT ALERT!!

If you press spacebar at the correct time (say like a 2 second window) then you eject and take fall damage. I guess we could roll for it. My thoughts below.

The Seraphim ACU has longer legs than the rest, so it could probably tuck and roll. Sera should get a bonus to save (think acrobatics).
Cybran should have those bugs from Big Hero 6 and never take fall damage. Just kinda ride them down to the ground. Maybe Cybran should always be able to do that. That might be OP - need further discussion.
UEF should just take regular fall damage - no bonuses. Maybe add a back upgrade for thrusters to minimize fall damage.
AEON have the option to pray halfway down. Same concept, zoom in and press spacebar to initiate prayer. Maybe you're save, maybe you're not.
Falling in water doesn't hurt - think Pacific Rim.
Shields don't effect falls in any way.

I dunno what to think of this.

I laughed the whole time I was reading it. can't tell if serious or not. though that setup (if serious) is as unbalanced as can be.

DarkTemplar wrote:
Aw come on!! I was a little serious!

heh.

it's kinda crazy to me that when a crazy-ass idea like this is brought up it gets seriously debated. but when you try that with com-blocking a non-mechanic meta-made part of the game nooooooo. Don't touch our presssiousssesss!

...maybe it just has to do the name of the person who brings it up...?

Statistics: Posted by tatsu — 28 Jul 2015, 23:21

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-28T23:15:37+02:00

I made some experiments with random units falling off a killed / damaged transport and then the actual position when the ACU hits the ground decides if it survives or not (i.e. a ACU falling into water survives if it hits the seabottom in "feet-first" position).

Kind of funny really seeing the ACU falling through the air, kicking their legs frantically in panic.

Statistics: Posted by Crotalus — 28 Jul 2015, 23:15

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-28T21:39:36+02:00

would be cool if you could know height from witch acu falls and speed that it has when crashes, and calculate damage useing those values...

but i don't really care about this change... ACU is so tall that if it falls it is gonna break for sure

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 28 Jul 2015, 21:39

Re: com death through transport kill

2015-07-28T21:35:47+02:00

The mod 'Paratroopers WIP07' already does this. A transport will drop its units mid air if the transport is destroyed. You can also do an emergency bail out for the units so that they fall out of a flying transport. In both instances, the transported (now falling) units suffer some damage when they hit the ground depending on height. Unfortunately, this mod is not working with the latest patch.

Statistics: Posted by The Mak — 28 Jul 2015, 21:35