Turtling in starcraft 2

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Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby prodromos » 03 Oct 2018, 01:45

Startcraft 2 is such a turtling game. Even in supreme commander's worst nightmare you would not see such turtling. After testing SC2 for 2 months now, it is clear that it has its merits; microing trains some important parts of our physiology, so it is good.
But regarding macro and the danger to fall into a loop of simcity, oh my god; you can so easily fall into a trap. Even its maps are made so that you can easily bunker behind a choke point, while options for breaking it are so limited; it is like thermos in micrography. Even map control does not translate so clearly to an advantage as in supreme commander forged alliance. Additionally scouting is problematic and can have a more than appropriate burden on your economy.
Sometimes I think esports waste their money on such archaic games...

Always trying new rts, but always returning to FA.
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Re: Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby ZeRenCZ » 04 Oct 2018, 10:54

prodromos wrote:Startcraft 2 is such a turtling game. Even in supreme commander's worst nightmare you would not see such turtling. After testing SC2 for 2 months now, it is clear that it has its merits; microing trains some important parts of our physiology, so it is good.
But regarding macro and the danger to fall into a loop of simcity, oh my god; you can so easily fall into a trap. Even its maps are made so that you can easily bunker behind a choke point, while options for breaking it are so limited; it is like thermos in micrography. Even map control does not translate so clearly to an advantage as in supreme commander forged alliance. Additionally scouting is problematic and can have a more than appropriate burden on your economy.
Sometimes I think esports waste their money on such archaic games...

Always trying new rts, but always returning to FA.

what is your rank in SC2? lower levels usually Terans are turtling, yes , but when you get gold+ it not that bad

races are very different, if you will play Teran like Zerg you gona lose, Teran needs chokepoint

btw. I find SC2s BOs more boring then FAFs, so I just play few games sometime to not get bored :D, well I dont play many games in FAF either it is not easy to find not turtle map in FAF to play
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Re: Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby prodromos » 05 Oct 2018, 11:07

I am defacto bronze, can't be more, because I have just started playing. However , experimenting, I discovered some liabilities(which SupCom doesn't have) and the game says I am silver tier 1 or gold tier 3; it fluctuates. However, since most of the success relies on microing your units, I am nowhere near these levels; only after a lot of practice I will reach them.
Anyway, your main base does not have access points by land , barring a choke point that it is easily defendable during the first couple of minutes. Something like Isis or GAP , but much worse. Air raids during minutes 3-7 are not viable as in supcom since nothing serious can be sent to opponent's base, and you only have serious chances if you are terran. It is true that Terrans turtle , but I have found them as the only most successful race to gather enough intel , and rush generally during minutes 0-10.

Additionally , map control is nowhere near rewarding as in Supcom. Even controlling sth like 60 to 80 percent of the map for a game lasting 30 mins+ can be negated by a single misclick or lost battle. Plus, after all this time, turtling has produced so many "point defenses" that it is certain you will lose if you attack an opponent of the same skill. Only, if you wait them to do so and win a battle or two can make them starve for resources and surrender. But they will not. I had the patience waiting for them to do so in a couple or so games and I won. But I can't afford wasting my time to any lame dude , that fantasizes he/she employs the mega strategy by doing plain sim city.
PS. I have found Protoss players, turtle much more often than Terrans, but they are the most obnoxious doing so
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Re: Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby Blodir » 05 Oct 2018, 16:35

sc2 is much less turtly than supcom where im at right now (master 1/ low gm)

at low level gameplay i imagine it's turtly because people aren't good enough to attack and macro at the same time
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Re: Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby prodromos » 05 Oct 2018, 23:46

at low level gameplay i imagine it's turtly because people aren't good enough to attack and macro at the same time


Most people are able to macro decently imho. It is microing that requires an insane amount of training. Of course , after some time ,
you acquire some automatism, but troop control and coordination of mouse and hotkeys is an order of magnitude bigger than in supcom.
I am silver because I am able to understand some peculiarities of economy and army development most newbies don't get. If not for this, my microing
would be subbronze and my rank deep black :).
This is partly due to the fact troops don't shoot while moving and when they shoot ,while standing ,they often target the wrong target. If you have
to give a specific command for every bullet your units shoot, this may take some skill, sure.But it takes too long to master comparatively and it just looks too archaic compared to supcom . It could be useful for training our neurokinetic abilities for better control of our supcom units though. You can find use in everything, if you look carefully.

If sc2 players had to command the amount of troops we have to command in supcom , they would suffer successive strokes hahaha! More than 1000 apm :roll:
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Re: Turtling in starcraft 2

Postby RussBar » 09 Oct 2018, 14:38

Other guys have pretty much said it, I can see why someone new to the game would think that, but SCII isn't that bad when it comes to turtling. In fact, when you turtle and give away the rest of the map to your opponent, you're pretty much screwed. Although, Protoss allows for a bit more turtling than other races even at higher levels of play. Relatively speaking.
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