Very hard game against a turtle

Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby biass » 27 Dec 2016, 07:26

Lets have a word about this:

Image

You're not acting on what you see with your very limited scouting, this enemy has done nothing but failures at this moment (has not made a tank yet, t2 mex in the middle of nowhere) but you decided to make some random pds in mid (that you now lost to random atys when you had 20 tanks next to them????????????????) when you could have actually done something with your units and acu far earlier and probably won

TL;DR You either A: don't scout enough, B: You dont actually look for what is happening when you scout or C: dont react to it properly, which is because of A or B

Other notes:
You have a rally point that leads into his 1st pd's range, all your new units just get killed before you notice they exist
You haven't taken top yet, despite defending it from him since for ages
You lost 2 t1 pds and 2 t1 factories to 3 t1 artys, what
Still unsure why you try to turtle outside his base on empty ground
You're not spending you mass OR your power
Don't cap ANY t2 mexes with mass storage until all your other safe t1 mexes are t2, mass storage is expensive for no real early game benefit
That -24 mass to make mass storage with all those engies, around half of your income
You're not scouting at all now, and all your air is AFK in base
You need to be making radars, not just one in your base
You're losing fights because you have 1 tanks defending and then another 50 afk in random corners of the map
You got gun a Long long time after seeing he has t2, did you really think this would work?
You raided his back but were not paying attention and he reclaimed your tank, lmao
You have no unit micro and trade horribly against lesser amounts of tanks because you sit them in his LOBO range for no reason (you dont scout)
Despite having 50 tanks to "defend" top right you lost the core mass to 2 tanks, nice no radars
You haven't reacted to the TML despite him shooting you for 10 minutes, you know you have air (he hasn't made more then 5 interceptors all game) try bombers
Sending 2 t1 tanks against 4 pds wont save you
Sending your interceptors over his base wont save you either
Don't scout with your interceptors

I stopped watching after 14 minutes, it was just a failure, sorry about that

Work on your scouting.
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby Flynn » 27 Dec 2016, 14:22

So in some ways I have to be more passive!
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby biass » 27 Dec 2016, 14:32

w-w-what?
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby Flynn » 27 Dec 2016, 15:04

I mean, less "pointless aggression" but I feel if I don't do something then the enemy will hit me instead.
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby biass » 27 Dec 2016, 15:36

Well make your "aggression" more potent then!
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby Lieutenant Lich » 27 Dec 2016, 20:55

It's not that, you need to scout and look at what the scout shows you. Then you won't put your rally points in T1 PD's range, you will know exactly how many tanks you need and where, you will know if your enemy goes for tech, more units, ACU upgrade, or ecowhores. When you know what he is doing, you will know what you will need to do (or you will figure out a way to counter it in time).
Don't complain about that which you aren't willing to change.

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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby Flynn » 31 Dec 2016, 21:22

I often find if I scout then I fall behind in other areas such as ecoing and microing my units. When the game gets past about 5 minutes I just don't have the APM to do all of them. Or I am doing something else when the scout plane flies over and I miss it.
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby tallian2 » 03 Jan 2017, 12:33

Flynn wrote:I often find if I scout then I fall behind in other areas such as ecoing and microing my units. When the game gets past about 5 minutes I just don't have the APM to do all of them. Or I am doing something else when the scout plane flies over and I miss it.


This is when knowing travel or build times is important. The simple method is:

Send scout/units to where you need them
Set up build queue while they travel
Watch scout/micro units while it build queue completes
Repeat.

It is a lot harder to master than it sounds.

Something that I find helps me is to start all mexes upgrade then pause them all. Have a bunch of engies upgrade them one at a time but have them all queued. Save the engie group (eg 0) then you can quickly pause/unpause the group as needed and any eco overflow is quickly dumped back into your eco expansion.

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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby Flynn » 11 Jan 2017, 15:46

Thanks but I know all of that!
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Re: Very hard game against a turtle

Postby RoLa » 29 Dec 2018, 19:56

One thing that helped me a lot was too zoom out as much and as often as possible.

One other thing on bigger maps in mid - late game: make one T1 air factory just producing scouts forever. Put the waypoints patrol points so that the scouts fly over your controlled teritorry so they patrol without to get shot. Every minute you send some scouts to explore enemy base.
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