Recommended adjustments

[Nombringer]

With all due respect Nom, I don't want this thread to derail into a 18 pages useless thread of opinions. Do you think it's efficient? I don't. (Niether do I. Too late though )

I'm merely posting my technical beta feedback, Zep can do whatever he wants with it according to his own judgement, including doing nothing. You are free to argue about the 3626 changes in the other threads. As for me, I'm done with the endless argumentation, I have better plans for my week end.
Zep can even lock this thread, I don't intend to argue every single change I tested. I just explained Zlo some changes that were not obvious for him.

That's my point. All you've done is move the argueing from it's proper thread to this one. If people feel that there idea are not being heard, then that's a problem with the whole system in general, not an excuse for everyone to start a thread about our own personal changes. I understand your position, but your missing the point that I'm trying to make. We can't all post our own feedback in seperate threads just so people see, or it will end up even worse then it is now. (and that's pretty bad) Personally I think this whole system needs a bit of a rework, but this is not the place or time.

[RoundTabler]

I think people get tired of the unending arguments, so they just make a new thread to try to move the process along. For example: have you seen the engy redesign threads? Theres FIVE or more. And some of them have 250 pages. Thats a lot to get through, and the first pages aren't current anymore. So sometimes it is relevant to start a new thread summing up the suggested changes.

[BRNKoINSANITY]

I still think the t2 naval factory needs more of a boost... With your suggested change the build time will still be well over 3 minutes and only draw about 12 mass. From my point of view the mass draw should be similar to the t3 factories for the main battle unit.

[Golol]

buildpowers shouldnt be adjusted much because you cant fine tune anymore.
if you want to build early t2 you cant if the buildpower of the factory is so high that it fucks up your whole eco.
putting 5-6 more engis around it is not that bad.

[pip]

I still think the t2 naval factory needs more of a boost... With your suggested change the build time will still be well over 3 minutes and only draw about 12 mass. From my point of view the mass draw should be similar to the t3 factories for the main battle unit.

3 min 20 is a big improvement over 4 min 10, don't you think? It's 25% faster, that's a lot. It will take as much time to get a destroyer, unassisted, as it takes now to build a Cruiser. And Cruiser will take 2min 40 to be built, unassisted, and all other t2 units lower than that.

If you go further, you will screw balance between power of land and air units compared to naval ones (naval units are much stronger, especially at t2, and that's why they take more time to be built). If you do this, it'll be necessary to modify plenty of other things.

[FunkOff]

I agree with pip on all counts in this topic.

[pip]

I added an item : Obsidian speed reduction to 2.7 (from 2.9). Now that Obsidians are really buffed and probably the best t2 tank (they never die!), they should be as slow as Ilshavoh (not faster). The gap in speed between pillar (speed = 3) and obsidians (currently 2.9) needs to be widened again.

[Nombringer]

Well I dont like the method but I agree with all the changes in here.

(I'm just secretly pleased, because I told a lot of people how good obsidian would be become and nobody listened )

[Ze_PilOt]

I won't change a single value, no replays are posted.

[pip]

- Upping t2 naval bp rate to 50 is part of adjusting engy mod, so that less engies are required to get naval units in a decent amount of time. It doesn't require a replay IMO (but you can check any replay involving a t2 naval yard, i'm posting one where the players have 12+ engies assisting it).

- adjusting the Wagner so that Cybran has 2 different tanks and not just two heavy tanks is a matter of game design, you cannot find this in replays. It's your choice to keep this weird situation instead of a more elegant solution.

- A replay for slightly reducing the Monkeylord veterancy has been uploaded by Arma, feel free to check it out.
viewtopic.php?f=57&t=4150

- The target priority fix is a bug fix / wrong mechanic fix. Ask Lu_Xun about it. If you need a replay that shows why it's a bad idea that t2 units prioritize t1 first instead of t3 units, here is one. It's not normal that you need to manually target Loyalists with Rhino and Ilshavoh when the Loyalists will automatically target the Ilshavoh, rhino, riptides etc, and not t1 units. By the way, I forgot to add Riptides and Blazes to the list.
I could agree that they prioritize t1 over t2, why not, (and even then I think it's a false good idea), but certainly not t1 over t3.

- For the 2 aeon nerfs, since nobody is playing balance testing in 1v1 except Zock and Chosen (Zock is better than Chosen and they haven't played Aeon much thus far), it'll be very hard to get replays. GW replays are not balanced because of reinforcements and access is no longer possible.
I guess we will wait till the next ladder is dominated by Aeon before adjusting them, same as what happened with Mantis.

- For UEF nano, 90% of the people who play don't know the changelog, they don't know that UEF nano is now OP (or even that it was changed, or even that this upgrade actually exists) so they will not use it. I guess we shall wait until someone figures out it is currently very easy to abuse.