Aircraft carriers changes.

Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby FunkOff » 09 Mar 2013, 22:41

Ze_PilOt wrote:It's an engine restriction : Only one command can be processed at a time. (moving and having a BO are two orders).


Actually, I think it's because a unit under construction cannot move. Think of ACUs with TML backpacks, they can walk while building the missiles.... The carrier could potentially move while building, but the aircraft it was constructing would stay in the place it was when construction started.... and that would be weird.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby Pathogenic » 10 Mar 2013, 06:08

Maybe you could have it use the same logic for missile building for construction of aircraft. When the construction is completed on the carrier, the fake "missile" that was being constructed gets converted into the aircraft you were building. So the aircraft does not exist while it is being constructed, it would not actually be a unit under construction in the eyes of the program, it just uses the same logic as it does for missile construction, and when it is done the aircraft is simply added to the carriers inventory.

I'll bet it can be done, even if it uses a bit of a hack to get it implemented.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby Veta » 10 Mar 2013, 08:17

Pathogenic wrote:Maybe you could have it use the same logic for missile building for construction of aircraft. When the construction is completed on the carrier, the fake "missile" that was being constructed gets converted into the aircraft you were building. So the aircraft does not exist while it is being constructed, it would not actually be a unit under construction in the eyes of the program, it just uses the same logic as it does for missile construction, and when it is done the aircraft is simply added to the carriers inventory.

I'll bet it can be done, even if it uses a bit of a hack to get it implemented.

this

would be a nice buff to all the factory experimentals too
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby FunkOff » 10 Mar 2013, 09:06

Pathogenic wrote:Maybe you could have it use the same logic for missile building for construction of aircraft. When the construction is completed on the carrier, the fake "missile" that was being constructed gets converted into the aircraft you were building. So the aircraft does not exist while it is being constructed, it would not actually be a unit under construction in the eyes of the program, it just uses the same logic as it does for missile construction, and when it is done the aircraft is simply added to the carriers inventory.


This is possible and I've previously modded an aircraft carrier to do this with torpedo bombers. The problem is you can't get an aircraft to do this with multiple aircraft types.... you pick one plane and that's the only plane your aircraft carriers can build.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby IceDreamer » 10 Mar 2013, 14:10

I was serious in what I said. I loved how in SupCom Vanilla, the Atlantis was an expensive unit which gave total naval dominance when built in force. It was the undisputed king of the seas, and I think it should be once more. The factory functions were always the sub-focus, not the primary concern, a way for it to build additional defence for attack by Torpedo Bombers, or as a mobile, stealthed, unknown production facility.

I think that Subs/Subkillers should be able to take it down mass for mass, but that an early Atlantis into an empty ocean will secure naval dominance unless it can be bombed out.

Alternatively, I would be good for a MASSIVELY significant buff to both the Torpedo Defence and AA of Atlantis, say able to repel >20 enemy Barracuda, and with say a 500% increase in AA power, preferable with a much higher ROF to create the epic stream of missiles we had in V1 of Vanilla. This would turn Atlantis into a true ocean-going Fatboy: A super-cruiser, capable of defending the fleet from most attacks, scouting out with LOS, Radar, and Sonar, building backup forces, and deploying impressive, but not overwhelming, firepower.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby pip » 10 Mar 2013, 14:39

The Atlantis has 1120 AA DPS at 100 range. It's very easy to kill lots of planes from far away and get veternacy for the Atlantis (much easier and faster to get veterancy from killing aircrafts than subs). It's a pretty good unit considering its price.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby Pathogenic » 10 Mar 2013, 17:39

pip wrote:The Atlantis has 1120 AA DPS at 100 range. It's very easy to kill lots of planes from far away and get veternacy for the Atlantis (much easier and faster to get veterancy from killing aircrafts than subs). It's a pretty good unit considering its price.


I thought it was only 320 dps?
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby pip » 10 Mar 2013, 17:47

Pathogenic wrote:
pip wrote:The Atlantis has 1120 AA DPS at 100 range. It's very easy to kill lots of planes from far away and get veternacy for the Atlantis (much easier and faster to get veterancy from killing aircrafts than subs). It's a pretty good unit considering its price.


I thought it was only 320 dps?


The DB is wrong, there is a bug somewhere.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby A_vehicle » 11 Mar 2013, 01:00

One thing that should be changed is the fact that all the guns on all aircraft carriers target the primary aa gun's target. For example, the Cybran carrier has four aa guns but they all always target the same plane. They should divide their fire between targets. This can be done by setting
Code: Select all
            PrefersPrimaryWeaponTarget
to false on all auxilary aa weapon fields on all carriers so they are not slaved to the gun listed first in the blueprint.

EDIT: In addition, aircraft carriers should be faster. You can say battleships are slow because they have tons of armor. Aircraft carriers are slow because of... what? There is no reason for them to be slow. Even in real life, some of the fastest warships are aircraft carriers because they are gigantic, have little armor, and thus have alot of room for big engines.

Carriers are slower than battleships. How can you expect a carrier to support the fastest units in the game if they themselves are slower than battleships? They need to be faster, with a movement speed of about 4, maybe 4.5.

Carrier movement speed=3
Battleship movement speed=3.5
Cruiser movement speed=4.5
Destroyer movement speed=5
Slowest air unit=6 (Novax defense satellite)
Slowest air unit that can ride in a carrier=8 (restorer)
Fastest air unit/unit in game=30 (spy plane)

Carriers should be fast enough to keep up with air units to some extent.
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Re: Aircraft carriers changes.

Postby FunkOff » 11 Mar 2013, 02:52

A_vehicle wrote:One thing that should be changed is the fact that all the guns on all aircraft carriers target the primary aa gun's target. For example, the Cybran carrier has four aa guns but they all always target the same plane. They should divide their fire between targets.


What? No, don't be stupid. It literally cuts the carrier's effectivenessf.

Consider 8 gunships attacking a carrier. If all four guns target different gunships, the carrier will take more damage.

Time = x, y = number of gunships shooting the carrier, assuming 1 gun takes 4 seconds to kill 1 gunship:
Focus firing:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
8 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 0
Average: 4 gunships shooting the carrier on average, thus 4 x 8 = 32 gunship seconds of carrier damage

Not focus firing:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
8 8 8 8 4 4 4 4 0
Average : 6 gunships shooting the carrier, thus 6 x 8 = 48 gunship seconds of carrier damage, a 50% increase!
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