Nomad Units, Full Overview.

General Discussions about The Nomads.

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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby Batmansrueckkehr » 11 Dec 2012, 09:47

well, on paper the cruisers seems to be the diamond beyond the nomads navy. but keep in mind it will be the first units which will get shoot.
before u change something there, i would to some more testing. maybe not to change the duration of the stun effect but the range of the canon.
with this you will have more cruisers than destroyers in ur navy to get them all stuned - but u have to manage to get in range which is difficult because of low hp of the cruiser. the opponent will have to micro his ships out of range to survive and use his range. sounds like an interesting fight.
but let it be tested as it is right now.
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby pip » 11 Dec 2012, 10:06

Batmansrueckkehr wrote:well, on paper the cruisers seems to be the diamond beyond the nomads navy. but keep in mind it will be the first units which will get shoot.
before u change something there, i would to some more testing. maybe not to change the duration of the stun effect but the range of the canon.
with this you will have more cruisers than destroyers in ur navy to get them all stuned - but u have to manage to get in range which is difficult because of low hp of the cruiser. the opponent will have to micro his ships out of range to survive and use his range. sounds like an interesting fight.
but let it be tested as it is right now.


The range of the cruiser EMP weapon is meant to counter shields more than paralyze stuff. At the longest range, it's more difficult to paralyze, because there is more time for the projectiles to travel and more inaccuracy, it's easier for the target to escape just by moving. EMP to stun is most efficient at medium range. The long range, however, means that even if the shots are not precise, they will hit shields. Cruisers target shields before anything else.

The other 2 naval units have less range : they need to come closer to deal with units that may be stunned byt he cruiser that can stay a bit behind. Cruisers are for support, they should not be in the front line, otherwise, they will just be killed by frigates and destroyers.

For now, the intended changes are :
- stun duration reduced by 0.1 sec
- slower rate of fire and less accuracy of EMP weapon, but around same DPS to shields

As for the Destroyer, it will have less DPS but more HP, otherwise, it's too easy to kill them with mass subs when you have killed all railgun boats around. The frigate will also have +50 HP.
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby killhard » 11 Dec 2012, 10:19

Well i can not wait to test it , hope this evening some players are online to get some nice naval fights !!!!
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby Batmansrueckkehr » 11 Dec 2012, 13:19

mass subs will kill the destroyer anyway if the railgunboats are gone - no hp increase will save them. if u increase hp and give less dps it would be very similar to other destroyers.
what is very powerful is the rate of fire. many things have low hp or less dps but this all is compensated with high rate of fire. so you could make the nomads destroyer special in low hp but it fires more often. this is how the cybran destroyer works - it has low hp too, but its high rof compensates it - less overkill, it can take under fire from one target to the next within 1 sec. very powerful and the only advantage it got (besides the really good torp def). cybran t2 pd is same - less hp but good rof. or make its projectiles faster so it hits even at high range.
it is just an idea, u can think of it. dps and hp is not all. or, you can give it 4000hp and a shield like the obsidian tank of 1700hp. so you can retread and get recharged the shield - maybe dont call it shield but reactive armor or so ;).
but i would test the navy first, before changing anything.

300 dps is not much dmg vs shields. so 2 cruisers take 14 secs to get a single shield boat down. imagin there 5 shield boats - nomads would be doomed vs uef. no good subs to go under the shield and kill it. uef just needs 5 shield boats 4 destroyers and 2 cruisers + some frigates/subs to get the nomads in big trouble with the same amount of a fleet. i am facing that with cybran and can only survive with t2 subs which are able to kill the shield boats before getting killed by torp boats. but nomads i see no light at the end of the "uef tunnel". same with aoen t2 mob shields. vs aoen i have no clue with cybran either how to compete - but even more difficult with nomads i think.

aoen absolver costs 420 mass and deals 600dps to shields. this would make sense :D the nomad cruiser is expensive enough to get similar dps vs shields. its rockets have less range and dont deal so much dmg so the shield dps should be increased on the other hand.

i cant do any testing today :( but would be nice to test some navy fights tomorrow evening.
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby pip » 11 Dec 2012, 13:26

Batmansrueckkehr wrote:mass subs will kill the destroyer anyway if the railgunboats are gone - no hp increase will save them. if u increase hp and give less dps it would be very similar to other destroyers.
what is very powerful is the rate of fire. many things have low hp or less dps but this all is compensated with high rate of fire. so you could make the nomads destroyer special in low hp but it fires more often. this is how the cybran destroyer works - it has low hp too, but its high rof compensates it - less overkill, it can take under fire from one target to the next within 1 sec. very powerful and the only advantage it got (besides the really good torp def). cybran t2 pd is same - less hp but good rof. or make its projectiles faster so it hits even at high range.
it is just an idea, u can think of it. dps and hp is not all. or, you can give it 4000hp and a shield like the obsidian tank of 1700hp. so you can retread and get recharged the shield - maybe dont call it shield but reactive armor or so ;).
but i would test the navy first, before changing anything.

300 dps is not much dmg vs shields. so 2 cruisers take 14 secs to get a single shield boat down. imagin there 5 shield boats - nomads would be doomed vs uef. no good subs to go under the shield and kill it. uef just needs 5 shield boats 4 destroyers and 2 cruisers + some frigates/subs to get the nomads in big trouble with the same amount of a fleet. i am facing that with cybran and can only survive with t2 subs which are able to kill the shield boats before getting killed by torp boats. but nomads i see no light at the end of the "uef tunnel". same with aoen t2 mob shields. vs aoen i have no clue with cybran either how to compete - but even more difficult with nomads i think.

aoen absolver costs 420 mass and deals 600dps to shields. this would make sense :D the nomad cruiser is expensive enough to get similar dps vs shields. its rockets have less range and dont deal so much dmg so the shield dps should be increased on the other hand.

i cant do any testing today :( but would be nice to test some navy fights tomorrow evening.


Nomads need to have not only railgun boats but also t1 subs in their navy. Their t1 sub is pretty good.

The Cruiser deals 300 DPS to shield only with its EMP weapon, if you add the missile, DPS it's around 420 total DPS against shields.
The Destroyer deals also around 300 DPS to shields at 70 range, no other Destroyer can do that. And if you use bombardment mode, it will deal around 600 DPS to shield boats because its rate of fire is doubled and even if the accuracy is terrible agaisnt normal ships, it will hit the shield.
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby Softly » 11 Dec 2012, 13:26

Me and killhard did some testing and if we're all on later there'll be some good things to discuss regarding nomads navy
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby pip » 11 Dec 2012, 13:29

DilliDalli wrote:Me and killhard did some testing and if we're all on later there'll be some good things to discuss regarding nomads navy


I saw the replay and some issues.

But you should try to test t2 subs against their equivalent in UEF torpedo boats, and also seraphim t3 subs against them, you will see how asymetric unit counters work in the game.

Keep also in mind that units with less range but faster speed need to go in, if they kite, they will always lose to units with longer range.
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby killhard » 11 Dec 2012, 13:43

Yes whe found out some intresting things to discuss about :)
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby ColonelSheppard » 23 Dec 2012, 18:39

you have to make and explanation how to counter/use snipertanks before the open beta or you will cause much rage
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Re: Nomad Units, Full Overview.

Postby pip » 23 Dec 2012, 20:54

You can counter them with : artilleries, labs, bombers, ACU weapon upgrade, or anything that will make the sniper tanks move. But the best strat is to send scouts forward, o that the sniper tanks waste their shots, then move in with your units while they reload. It's good to have a few labs in your army so that they can approach sniper tanks faster.
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